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A question I am sure is burning in everyone’s minds is "Will gog.com ever support Linux", well I aim to give this a bit of limelight here on GOL.
First of all let me direct you to this wishlist item on gog.com itself which has 11,125 votes on it, I find that crazy that a store like gog.com has that many customers who want to support them with their money if they just put up Linux versions of games. So while you are on that page be sure to give it a vote if you like DRM Free games in a standalone download, no messing around with clients like Steam or Desura.
Now something else has popped up on my email radar recently, I am speaking about Simon Roth the developer of Maia who stated this on reddit in response to a question from one of our supporters FutureSuture;
That sounds vaguely promising doesn't it? Well I choose to look at it that way anyway.
Personally I think gog.com run a great service for the PC Gaming industry making sure gamers have a place to get games new and old that aren't filled with any DRM, it's really a great store, hell I am even a customer!
I have a copy of Freespace 2 and Theme Hospital from them to use on the open source engines, I would gladly buy more from them too if they only allowed Linux versions up.
Although this did get me thinking, is it difficult for developers to bundle Linux, Mac and Windows executables in one package? I have seen some developers do this before so I know it is possible and wonder why more don't do that?
That's not exactly a full solution though, we need gog.com to note if a game has a Linux version and support us on it. Personally I consider them one of our major roadblocks for getting accepted as a major gaming platform considering how big a store they are.
The more places that support us the more people can learn Linux exists too right? That can only be a good thing.
What are your thoughts folks?
Article taken from GamingOnLinux.com.
First of all let me direct you to this wishlist item on gog.com itself which has 11,125 votes on it, I find that crazy that a store like gog.com has that many customers who want to support them with their money if they just put up Linux versions of games. So while you are on that page be sure to give it a vote if you like DRM Free games in a standalone download, no messing around with clients like Steam or Desura.
Now something else has popped up on my email radar recently, I am speaking about Simon Roth the developer of Maia who stated this on reddit in response to a question from one of our supporters FutureSuture;
QuoteI've spoken in person at length about this with them. I can say no more!
That sounds vaguely promising doesn't it? Well I choose to look at it that way anyway.
Personally I think gog.com run a great service for the PC Gaming industry making sure gamers have a place to get games new and old that aren't filled with any DRM, it's really a great store, hell I am even a customer!
I have a copy of Freespace 2 and Theme Hospital from them to use on the open source engines, I would gladly buy more from them too if they only allowed Linux versions up.
Although this did get me thinking, is it difficult for developers to bundle Linux, Mac and Windows executables in one package? I have seen some developers do this before so I know it is possible and wonder why more don't do that?
That's not exactly a full solution though, we need gog.com to note if a game has a Linux version and support us on it. Personally I consider them one of our major roadblocks for getting accepted as a major gaming platform considering how big a store they are.
The more places that support us the more people can learn Linux exists too right? That can only be a good thing.
What are your thoughts folks?
Article taken from GamingOnLinux.com.
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For the games in question, meaning native Linux Games?Really, stop it! You can get most of the games in question DRM free from half a dozen sources. But no, the one giving you the least respect just has to be it!
Well, you made me curious. What is the alternative to GoG these days? Honestly I haven't the foggiest. Is there anyone else that carries the games that they have in their catalogue?
I usually start with checking the developer's web-site. At least half of them don't bother with DRM anyways. More like 2/3 of them.
If their DRM consists of memorizing a password and otherwise allows me to do what I want with my game, I'm ok with that too (Minecraft for example).
Then I check Desura. They were the first Linuxer of the whole bunch.
Then Humble Bundle, porting games to Linux before Steam did even think about it.
Gamingonlinux.com too is on my bookmark list for a reason.
GoG is great for old Windows games, I give them that. But the way they handled this story, with one lame comment, borderline insulting if you know a bit about Linux, is a deal breaker for me for a long time to come.
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GoG is great for old Windows games, I give them that. But the way they handled this story, with one lame comment, borderline insulting if you know a bit about Linux, is a deal breaker for me for a long time to come.
Yep, that was what I was asking for. Alternative to get DRM free, old Windows games that do not have Linux ports.
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This is probably buried too deep in the thread, but wanted to give a heads up about something. Portable Linux games has quite a few Games they packaged that don't need to be installed. Some even have Wine linked in if it's not a native Game. Just thought I would share.
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No, you're right on that. Afaik GoG is unique on that., at least if you consider perfect legality as a selling point in itself.GoG is great for old Windows games, I give them that. But the way they handled this story, with one lame comment, borderline insulting if you know a bit about Linux, is a deal breaker for me for a long time to come.
Yep, that was what I was asking for. Alternative to get DRM free, old Windows games that do not have Linux ports.
But my point is a different one.
Yes, I'd do begging for a while and I too voted there for a feature that's as simple as it gets: An html link, pretty please!
But I won't stalk them like a rejected lover with self-esteem issues.
There's a point where I vote with my wallet. And if a company manages to cross that line, an elephant looks like an alzheimer patient compared to me.
So as far as I'm concerned, GoG is on the same blacklist as Ubisoft for example, although for a different reason.
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That's the point: Valve has its own client that manages games and has its own "packaging" format that don't follow the Linux guidelines. To play Steam games, you have to use the Steam client.IIRC, GOG had an interview last year (when they released games for MacOS) where they explained that they'd like to support Linux, they've looked into it but at the time they didn't have a proper solution for distributing the games because of the various distros which have several packages formats and such.
One can always make up excuses for not doing something. Valve does not seem to have that problem and Linux games downloaded through the Steam client are distro agnostic. Developers don't need to touch the packaging system of any distribution.
GOG doesn't use a client, it lets users download standard installers. On Windows & MacOS, there is a standard way to install games. On Linux, we have separated admin and user data, with software installation being handled by the admin (or a user that can obtain the required privileges) and not supposed to be installed in the user dir, multiple packaging formats depending on the distro being used... If GOG wanted to provide Linux versions of games, they'd had to choose how to do it: provide every format imaginable (DEB package + RPM package + .tar.gz archive + other eventual formats)? provide only a .tar.gz archive (which isn't user-friendly at all)? provide an installation script ? How do they handle the dependancies (libs or DOSBox for old DOS games)?
Linux is a great OS but its diversity and lack of standardisation can be a bad thing at times: while free/open source software can be released in a basic form and let the distros maintainers package it for easy installation, it's the opposite for closed/commercial software that has to be handled by a publisher.
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It is all just a bunch of excuses. Tonnes of development studios and publishers have released Linux version no problem. GOG could find a way. Want to officially support only one distro? Fine. Want to provide unsupported installers for Linux as extras? Fine. They don't have to do it in a certain way. But no, they decide if they can't support the Rasperry Pi they can't support Linux. That is an excuse. Nothing more, nothing less. They have a blind spot for Linux as far as rational decision making goes. They positively want to have an inferior version of games like The Book of Unwritten Tales. They see not supporting Linux as a badge of honor, as a goal in it self.That's the point: Valve has its own client that manages games and has its own "packaging" format that don't follow the Linux guidelines. To play Steam games, you have to use the Steam client.IIRC, GOG had an interview last year (when they released games for MacOS) where they explained that they'd like to support Linux, they've looked into it but at the time they didn't have a proper solution for distributing the games because of the various distros which have several packages formats and such.
One can always make up excuses for not doing something. Valve does not seem to have that problem and Linux games downloaded through the Steam client are distro agnostic. Developers don't need to touch the packaging system of any distribution.
GOG doesn't use a client, it lets users download standard installers. On Windows & MacOS, there is a standard way to install games. On Linux, we have separated admin and user data, with software installation being handled by the admin (or a user that can obtain the required privileges) and not supposed to be installed in the user dir, multiple packaging formats depending on the distro being used... If GOG wanted to provide Linux versions of games, they'd had to choose how to do it: provide every format imaginable (DEB package + RPM package + .tar.gz archive + other eventual formats)? provide only a .tar.gz archive (which isn't user-friendly at all)? provide an installation script ? How do they handle the dependancies (libs or DOSBox for old DOS games)?
Linux is a great OS but its diversity and lack of standardisation can be a bad thing at times: while free/open source software can be released in a basic form and let the distros maintainers package it for easy installation, it's the opposite for closed/commercial software that has to be handled by a publisher.
I would love to see GOG's reaction if some indie studio decided to hide Linux binaries in the GOG version of their game. They would probably stop selling that game or remove the hidden Linux version or something.
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I have several games in my gog account, but stopped buying games there months ago
as they don't care about linux support. If that changes one day, I'd be glad to buy more games - plain and simple.
As this wasn't mentioned yet, you might be interested in
http://www.gogonlinux.com (not too active, afaik it's only one developer)
and
https://sites.google.com/site/gogdownloader
I try to keep them both more or less up2date in the gentoo gamerlay btw
as they don't care about linux support. If that changes one day, I'd be glad to buy more games - plain and simple.
As this wasn't mentioned yet, you might be interested in
http://www.gogonlinux.com (not too active, afaik it's only one developer)
and
https://sites.google.com/site/gogdownloader
I try to keep them both more or less up2date in the gentoo gamerlay btw
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if GOG wanted to provide Linux versions of games, they'd had to choose how to do it: provide every format imaginable (DEB package + RPM package + .tar.gz archive + other eventual formats)? provide only a .tar.gz archive
I don't see this obsession to have games installed via rpm/deb, many of the humble bundle games use the .bin installer and that one works just fine, GoG could easily make a standard installer for their games using those as a basis. Its just another excuse as many said here. They just don't want to spend the time and effort, and that fine as its their company, simple as that.
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GoG is great for old Windows games, I give them that. But the way they handled this story, with one lame comment, borderline insulting if you know a bit about Linux, is a deal breaker for me for a long time to come.
In reply to this, and previous commenters who asked, why the question of Linux support on GOG is still active. The answer is rather simple - GOG is second biggest digital distributor after Steam, and in contrast with Steam it's principally DRM free. GOG don't position themselves as targeted for old games exclusively anymore. They are directly competing with Steam already and bring more and more new games.
So to answer the questions above - if you want DRM free gaming on Linux, you should support the idea of Linux games on GOG. Steam is not an option, since I highly doubt they'll drop DRM any time soon - they are too entangled with DRM obsessed publishers, and dropping DRM would mean removing all DRMed games from the catalog, or convincing dumb publishers to allow their games to be sold without DRM, which is a huge task and Valve doesn't seem to be even interested to bother.
If GOG would start supporting Linux, they can even allocate resources to actually port games to Linux. If Humble Bundle managed to do it, surely GOG can do it too.
Why it can take them a long time - GOG are perfectionists. I personally think it has a lot of downsides, but that's how they operate. They don't use agile releases and beta features. They take their time to develop something before releasing it. They have several R&D projects for 2013, one of which can as well be Linux support. The fact that "Steam does it" doesn't mean they are doing it very well. Pulling a massive runtime to enable some game is not really an ideal option.
And indeed, GOG expressed their interest in supporting Linux before.
As this wasn't mentioned yet, you might be interested in
http://www.gogonlinux.com (not too active, afaik it's only one developer)
and
https://sites.google.com/site/gogdownloader
I try to keep them both more or less up2date in the gentoo gamerlay btw
I prefer the second one.
Project site: https://github.com/Sude-/lgogdownloader
Announcements thread: https://secure.gog.com/forum/general/lgogdownloader_gogdownloader_for_linux
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I don't see this obsession to have games installed via rpm/deb, many of the humble bundle games use the .bin installer and that one works just fine, GoG could easily make a standard installer for their games using those as a basis. Its just another excuse as many said here.
They DO have their own custom standard installer already for their Mac and Windows games. And the guy who believes that distributing commercial games on Linux is so difficult because of dependency and administration issues is prattling on about a problem which has been solved since Loki. Besides, GoG games do not tie into one central Dosbox install when they sell their games anyway, but ship with a custom configured executable with each game purchase. Can you imagine the trouble that would cause if it did? Just because Linux has a packaging system does not mean you need to do that level of dependent insanity.
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Besides, GoG games do not tie into one central Dosbox install when they sell their games anyway, but ship with a custom configured executable with each game purchase. Can you imagine the trouble that would cause if it did? Just because Linux has a packaging system does not mean you need to do that level of dependent insanity.Which is rather silly and is caused by the lack of any packaging system on Windows. On Linux they have no need to package DosBox and ScummVM for each DOS game - it's pointless, they can use distro's emualtors and ship only config files.
But those games aren't really the main focus in this issue. Native Linux games are. And for them as you said, many packaging solutions are developed already.
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Well getting their Dosbox library to Linux would probably be very easy and could be a good start of moving GOG to Linux. The two most wanted things for them to do in regards to Linux is to package their Dosbox(and ScummVM, etc) games for Linux and to add installers/binaries for games that already have them. As for why they package Dosbox with each game? To make sure those who buy the game can run it out of the box.Besides, GoG games do not tie into one central Dosbox install when they sell their games anyway, but ship with a custom configured executable with each game purchase. Can you imagine the trouble that would cause if it did? Just because Linux has a packaging system does not mean you need to do that level of dependent insanity.Which is rather silly and is caused by the lack of any packaging system on Windows. On Linux they have no need to package DosBox and ScummVM for each DOS game - it's pointless, they can use distro's emualtors and ship only config files.
But those games aren't really the main focus in this issue. Native Linux games are. And for them as you said, many packaging solutions are developed already.
They can't be sure that you have Dosbox installed and without using (several) distro depended package managers they can't do that on Linux either(Does Dosbox even have packages?).
The ideal for a company like GOG is that you can use only one installer or similar on any Linux system using any (supported) distro and it will just work. They would want game installation to be a self-contained thing that any "noob"(and there ARE Linux "noobs" ) could do.
Personally I don't see why things should have to be any harder on the Linux side than on the Windows side but I also can't think of any technical reason for why things couldn't be just as a easy and universal on the Linux side.
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I actually would strongly dislike if they'll release DOS games for Linux with bundled DosBox and ScummVM - it's extra clutter. They can specify a simple prerequisite - have DosBox / ScummVM installed for those games. Users aren't dumb, and if they are interested in old DOS games, they already have DosBox and ScummVM installed with high probability (and if they don't, they'll easily install it from their repositories). Many Windows users are also "noobs", yet GOG don't bundle for example DirectX with each Windows game.
Anyway, this shouldn't be something for GOG to spend their time on first, while they don't sell native Linux games yet. Their DOS games installers are trivially extractable with innoextract and anyone can play them now without running through Wine.
Anyway, this shouldn't be something for GOG to spend their time on first, while they don't sell native Linux games yet. Their DOS games installers are trivially extractable with innoextract and anyone can play them now without running through Wine.
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I run Arx Liberatis using the Arx Fatalis files I purchased from GOG. I have advised people who have encountered 7kaa to buy the game on GOG, just to get the detailed manual. When I see The Panumbra Trilogy and Amnesia: The Dark Descent on GOG, I grit my teeth.
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I run Arx Liberatis using the Arx Fatalis files I purchased from GOG. I have advised people who have encountered 7kaa to buy the game on GOG, just to get the detailed manual. When I see The Panumbra Trilogy and Amnesia: The Dark Descent on GOG, I grit my teeth.7kaa is open source though http://7kfans.com/ pretty sure it's even in Ubuntu's repo nowadays.
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I actually would strongly dislike if they'll release DOS games for Linux with bundled DosBox and ScummVM - it's extra clutter. They can specify a simple prerequisite - have DosBox / ScummVM installed for those games. Users aren't dumb, and if they are interested in old DOS games, they already have DosBox and ScummVM installed with high probability (and if they don't, they'll easily install it from their repositories). Many Windows users are also "noobs", yet GOG don't bundle for example DirectX with each Windows game.DosBox and ScummVM are small enough that I wouldn't care if they bundled them to make an out-of-the-box experience for those who want it -- it's easy enough to delete an unneeded subdir after the game is installed, like gogonlinux already does for a bundled windows DosBox
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If GOG would start supporting Linux, they can even allocate resources to actually port games to Linux. If Humble Bundle managed to do it, surely GOG can do it too.That's a misunderstanding that also occurs a lot on the wishlist discussion also.
Why it can take them a long time - GOG are perfectionists. I personally think it has a lot of downsides, but that's how they operate. They don't use agile releases and beta features. They take their time to develop something before releasing it. They have several R&D projects for 2013, one of which can as well be Linux support. The fact that "Steam does it" doesn't mean they are doing it very well. Pulling a massive runtime to enable some game is not really an ideal option.
And indeed, GOG expressed their interest in supporting Linux before.
GoG not supporting Linux isn't the issue at all. It's not that they passively do not support Linux, they actively remove Linux support from the software they are selling.
They get a bundle from the developers, take one package out of it and throw it to the bin instead of providing it to us.
When asked by 10k of their customers what they think they are doing, all we get back is "Aww, not now, it's so haaard to support you !" with one single PR-speak comment during the whole affair.
They even had the nerve to spin the story where their shiny installer appears as the killer feature they just can't take the responsibility to let us live without.
I've called BS on far more convincing strories. If you think all that actually makes sense, fine, who knows.
But discussing about them actually porting a single codeline to Linux when in fact they remove Linux support given to us from the game-devs, and then completely ignore our bug report, that is a bit far-fetched, methinks.
Given all that, I'm not so sure we won't see DRM free Steam games before GoG even opening up to a fair debate.
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There are already games on Steam that don't require steam to even be running, Steam already supports it.
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Which is rather silly and is caused by the lack of any packaging system on Windows. On Linux they have no need to package DosBox and ScummVM for each DOS game - it's pointless, they can use distro's emualtors and ship only config files.
It is not silly, it makes the games much easier to maintain for GoG and run on a much wider range of systems. Tying a commercial application into a variety of distribution's package management systems is a pain in the ass, and is not worth the effort for something which is not a dynamic free software project which are easier to package and allow the distributions themselves to do most of the work. Dosbox and ScummVM may be free, but the GoG products and modifications are not, and they should be treated just the same as any other proprietary application.
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There are already games on Steam that don't require steam to even be running, Steam already supports it.
For me DRM free means several things:
1. Having an option to get a downloadable installer / package which you can save and use at any time on any machine without relying on existing service.
2. No registration keys and etc. to play the game.
3. No requirement to run some shadow process ("client" and etc.) to play the game.
4. No requirement to connect to any servers to play the game (unless it's a MMORPG or something that implies on-line connectivity by design of course).
I'm not using Steam, but I got the impression that it requires #3 (running a client) for many games. And while it doesn't require it for some games, it doesn't offer a downloadable installer for any game. So there always is some DRM involved. I'd rather support services which have clear DRM free policy.
Dosbox and ScummVM may be free, but the GoG products and modifications are not, and they should be treated just the same as any proprietary application.
Do you mean they distribute modified DosBox and ScummVM? I'm not aware of that. None of the DOS games I got from GOG so far had any problems running in stock DosBox and ScummVM. It's not an indicator of course, since I have just a small subset of their games. But sure, if they need a modified emulator - the only way is to ship it with the game. On the other hand, why can't they submit their patches upstream in such cases?
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