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Quite a controversial topic currently floating around is that a change proposal has been made for Fedora Workstation 40 to have some "privacy-preserving" telemetry to "enable limited data collection of anonymous Fedora Workstation usage metrics".

This has generated quite the buzz across pretty much everywhere I look, with many people on both sides jumping in to argue about it. One thing to remember though, is that this is a proposal, nothing has been set in stone and the whole idea could be scrapped or changed a lot as discussions go on.

In summary:

Fedora is an open source community project, and nobody is interested in violating user privacy. We do not want to collect data about individual users. We want to collect only aggregate usage metrics that are actually needed to achieve specific Fedora improvement objectives, and no more. We understand that if we violate our users’ trust, then we won’t have many users left, so if metrics collection is approved, we will need to be very careful to roll this out in a way that respects our users at all times. (For example, we should not collect users’ search queries, because that would be creepy.).

We believe an open source community can ethically collect limited aggregate data on how its software is used without involving big data companies or building creepy tracking profiles that are not in the best interests of users. Users will have the option to disable data upload before any data is sent for the first time. Our service will be operated by Fedora on Fedora infrastructure, and will not depend on Google Analytics or any other controversial third-party services. And in contrast to proprietary software operating systems, you can redirect the data collection to your own private metrics server instead of Fedora’s to see precisely what data is being collected from you, because the server components are open source too.

As for what they might actually be collecting there's all sorts but they're not yet being exactly clear on what, because approval for it hasn't happened as it's early days for the proposal. If they do get approval, it seems then they will work out a clear idea of what to collect. They did suggest some of it may be things like what IDEs are popular, the click-through rate of recommended banners in GNOME Software, what panels are most used in gnome-control-center, what type of hard drive you have, count how many users use a particular locale so they can optimize language support and so on.

Telemetry is not actually a bad thing but the way it has been used in the past is what gives it a bad name. Some companies absolutely abused data collection in the past, and plenty still do. There are ways to do it properly though which they seem to be trying to do by fully informing people here.

What's a little confusing though is their part about opt-in versus opt-out. The way it has been explained could have been better. It seems they want to go for opt-out, with it turned on to collect the data by default but not actually upload anything until you've gone through a privacy page when installing Fedora to confirm it. Disabling it will then send them nothing but it will still collect it locally ready for if you turn it on later. For existing users upgrading, it will be opt-in though, as they don't currently have a mechanism for getting user consent through upgrades. This opt-in / opt-out also has it's own discussion area since it's a big thing.

How do you feel about this idea? Let me know in the comments.

Article taken from GamingOnLinux.com.
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m2mg2 Jul 8, 2023
Quoting: mr-victoryKDE Plasma added opt-in telemetry and life went on. Fedora is considering telemetry and it blew up for some reason.

The big problem is installing it and activating it by default, giving the option to disable after the fact but you can click through it without even reading it or actually making a choice to authorize it. Opt out

They want to trick people into allowing it. Honestly I may change distros even if they don't move forward just because they are even seriously considering this and their developers are actively pushing for it.


Last edited by m2mg2 on 8 July 2023 at 8:20 pm UTC
slaapliedje Jul 8, 2023
Quoting: m2mg2
Quoting: mr-victoryKDE Plasma added opt-in telemetry and life went on. Fedora is considering telemetry and it blew up for some reason.

The big problem is installing it and activating it by default, giving the option to disable after the fact but you can click through it without even reading it or actually making a choice to authorize it. Opt out

They want to trick people into allowing it. Honestly I may change distros even if they don't move forward just because they are even seriously considering this and their developers are actively pushing for it.
Debian has had the popularity contest question for ages during install, but the click through / wnter key is by default off. And all that does is set a cron to show packages installed.

Telemetry in any way that is doing things in the background is, in my opinion, wrong. The only exception to that for me would be a bug reporting facility. Print out the crash data, and ask if it is okay to upload to a bugtracker. The thought of my OS just sending off info kind of disgusts me. See how much crap Windows does is appalling.
RenardDesMers Jul 9, 2023
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I must say I was quite baffled by the proponent's opinion that's basically "We want quality data, opt-in is useless data so if it's not opt-out, I don't want it".
ElectricPrism Jul 9, 2023
Good for Debian, Arch and others, bad for Fedora. (making people agitated that is)


Last edited by ElectricPrism on 9 July 2023 at 6:00 am UTC
Adutchman Jul 9, 2023
I do agree with most people that this should be opt-in, but I disagree that telemtry cannot be private. In a literal sense this is true, but I don't think that Fedora knowing which setting I use is privacy-invading. Data is so valuable for developers to see what all users are doing, not just power users. No need to do as if Fedora is evil just for collecting a bit of user data. Imo, they should let the user choose at install, let them know what they collect, but let the default option be on. This way, the telemetry is on with more people and the data is actually useful.
omer666 Jul 9, 2023
I think privacy advocacy may be going a little over the top on this subject. I'm all for it, I use a zero-access email provider, do my searches on Duckduckgo, have a LineageOS smartphone without Google services and so on, and yet I don't mind them collecting technical data. It's much less complete than Steam hardware survey and yet I'd bet every Linux gamer will gladly answer this one because they want to improve the system's visibility for game developers. Here the devs want to improve the system, but nope, no sir, this is bad and all.
fenglengshun Jul 9, 2023
I personally want this to be turned on, opt-out by default. I saw the proposed design and it seems fine to me. And the potential benefit to me is that Fedora and Gnome may stop being so out of touch that so many people uses the thing they refuse to ship by default for no reason and see any other user experience issues on the platform.
TheSHEEEP Jul 9, 2023
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Quoting: omer666I think privacy advocacy may be going a little over the top on this subject.
That's what they usually do, so yes.

Really, this seems very beneficial and absolutely harmless.
F.Ultra Jul 9, 2023
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Quoting: heidi.wengerRed Hat is now owned by IBM which once aided in committing holocaust. Why does IBM get away with this to modern day? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_and_the_Holocaust

To this and every other "IBM IS BEHIND THIS!!!" posts above I just want to point out that Red Hat representatives have come forward (they did this with the recent GPL thingy) and said that IBM have not directed Red Hat in any way shape or form, they exist as a independent brand under IBM and so far IBM have left them alone.
heidi.wenger Jul 9, 2023
Quoting: F.Ultra
Quoting: heidi.wengerRed Hat is now owned by IBM which once aided in committing holocaust. Why does IBM get away with this to modern day? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_and_the_Holocaust

To this and every other "IBM IS BEHIND THIS!!!" posts above I just want to point out that Red Hat representatives have come forward (they did this with the recent GPL thingy) and said that IBM have not directed Red Hat in any way shape or form, they exist as a independent brand under IBM and so far IBM have left them alone.

That may be, or it may not be that IBM have not adviced Red Hat "in any way shape or form". One thing is clear: Red Hat's ways and behavior has changed drastically in just few months. If IBM is not behind this, the situation could be considered even worse then. Red Hat was one of the bastions of freedom.
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