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To add a little proper reasoning to this;

QuoteThe LIMBO Linux build was created by CodeWeavers who basically take a custom version of Wine and tune the game to make sure it runs flawlessly. This is our first experiment with CodeWeavers and we are watching carefully.
If there are any bugs with the game, I don't want people to think "oh well, it uses Wine" -- these ought to be sent to CodeWeavers who should do their best to fix them.

QuoteWe typically help organize porting for the games in the bundle, and it's usually the toughest part! But we're rabid about trying to provide the best experience possible, and native ports usually do that.
But in the case of LIMBO, our porting friends said there was some audio middleware that's not easily supported on Linux, we decided to see if we could experiment with another solution that could provide a rock-solid Linux gaming experience. CodeWeavers took it on—they do highly customized Linux wrappers to optimize specific pieces of software—and the prototypes worked incredibly well. They spent a lot of time tweaking and optimizing, and it passed their QA and our QA (and seemed to perform more consistently than even some of the native ports we've seen).
But we get that software is hard, and so we'll try to keep an eye out for any showstoppers. Hit up [email protected] with any issues and we'll make sure CodeWeavers hears about any LIMBO bugs that need fixing.

So if you any of you do get issues, email them, make your thoughts known there, the petition will do nothing as it always does IMO.

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Firstly, it's important to note that Limbo runs via CrossOver rather than normal Wine.

I spoke briefly with the Humble Bundle guys about this. They say that they're treating Codeweavers as they would any other porter, and are working with them to fix and resolve issues as they would with any of the other bundle titles.

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I just scanned my copy of the Goodbye Galaxy hints and tricks sheet that I received and posted it on my blog:
http://www.mygamecompany.com/forums/showthread.php?2096-Commander-Keen-Mementos

Cool stuff!

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That's a nice treasure trove!

I still have some of the original 3-1/2 floppy disks I got from Apogee when I ordered Commander Keen: Goodbye Galaxy from them in 1992, as well as the official hints and tricks sheet. It was printed in black ink on red colored paper, and had an ad for Keen 6 "Aliens Ate My Babysitter" on the back. They also sent a floppy with demos for Secret Agent 1 and Crystal Caves 1.

I immediately purchased Keen 6 through them too, and I've still got the floppy disk, the instruction book, and the hints and tricks sheet for that game (2 sheets, printed on green colored paper and stapled together). They also sent a floppy with a demo for Cosmo's Cosmic Adventure.

Those games were like gold... been addicted ever since!

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You do not need to explain the allure to me Troy - I grew up playing Apogee games. Chips Challenge too, but anyway... ;)

My uncle had a disk full of Apogee game demos given to him after he gave us a fridge back in the day, so it is a kind of family interest in a way (though he is mostly a Civilization fanatic). Not quite the same as what was brought up here, but he taught us a few things about how to play Pagantizu, for instance.

I was more personally interested in the side scrollers like the original Duke Nukem games though. I may mostly be a FPS player but I still have time for a good side-scroller.

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I googled it, and I kinda remember it now - especially after it mentioned that it was part of the Microsoft Windows Entertainment Pack. I had that pack, but never played this particular game - I must have tried it at one point but didn't care for it.

I was more into games from Apogee, Sierra, and Interplay at the time. Those had better graphics, engaging stories/characters, and fun gameplay. That's where the inspiration comes for my games (at least the action-based ones). I also happen to love comic books (even drew a bunch of my own in high school and college), which is why my games have a cartoon/comic visual style and are very story-driven. I kinda carried my passion for drawing & reading comic books over into my game development when I started making games.

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I am not against the WINE project - I was using WINE to play an older game right before I came here to post this. Now, I am personally against purchasing modern Windows games to play them on Linux, but that is a subject for another thread.

The main thing I am worried about is that this can soil the Bundle's future potential on Linux. It is quite clear from Ryan Gordon's comments that he has a large vested interest in the Bundle as he feels it is the steeping stone we need to get the Linux games industry to finally be fully recognized - an actually vibrant native community where we are not always treated like second class citizens. We have come a long way towards this in the past few years, and I want this growth to continue.

This is a threat to that - it destroys the incentive to build that bright future just for short-term convenience through the use of a hack. It is like the snake-oil sold by Transgaming all over again. A relevant quote from the time of Loki's closure:

QuoteThe arrival of TransGaming to me is the clearest indication that Loki failed to jump-start a Linux gaming industry as we'd hoped, because TransGaming has nothing to do with Linux games. Their message to game developers is: "Use DirectX and develop for Windows. We'll help you sell your Windows products to Linux users." TransGaming's strategy is the same one Corel used in its Linux applications business. In the end I don't think they'll be any more successful than Corel was.

http://web.archive.org/web/20020202221402/http://www.newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=02/01/24/2118235

Humble Bundle could be seen as the new Loki, what could jump start Linux game development. I do not want to soil that opportunity just because someone did not pay attention when selecting their middle-ware.

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I've seen this before, have covered this before? I think they did a kickstarter last year or 8bit funding or somat like that.

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the bundle was (supposed) to be about?
i think it doesnt go against that.
if it works crossplatform (no matter if wine is used or not) then its "crossplatform".
wine is a good thing. it allows us to play the games that are never ported on our platform. it also runs some older games much better than u can run them in latest windows releases.
i do not own windows but i do buy windows games that work well in wine. Just the gamer inside me wants to do that.

ofc native ports are better. but i use all i can to enrich my gaming.

i personally have nothing agains winelib ports if they do work. and in my case, LIMBO works just perfectly with zero issues.

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I am frankly suprised by how many people are defending this, when it goes against everything the Bundle was (supposed) to be about, at least on Linux.

It was never supposed to be about WINE. It was supposed to be the catalyst for a more stable native market. Just because we are to be humble does not mean we need to allow ourselves to be tred on.

EDIT: Just to try and add a little levity:

Quoting: Tim SchaferLinux was like a party that sounded fun [but] we were afraid to go to because we didn’t think we’d know anybody there, and the HiB guys were like your socially fearless friend who says, “Don’t worry, we’ll go together.”

When he gets to your house he says: “Is that what you’re wearing?” and you say, “uh…” and he says, “Don’t worry. I know a guy.” And he lends you a cool leather jacket and you go to the party and when you walk in there’s a needle scratch and everybody turns to look at you and your friend gives a cool nod and then everybody goes back to the party.

So kind of like a John Hughes film. Hope that helps explain things. That’s about as technical as I can go. I just hope I don’t accidentally knock over a beer can pyramid that some tough guys are building.

Oh and also, if you want to be cool at the party, stay away from wine. (haha! Linux joke!)

[URL='http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/06/humble-bundle-devs-talk-gaming-on-linux?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+d0od+%28OMG!+Ubuntu!%29']http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2012/06/humble-bundle-devs-talk-gaming-on-linux?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed: d0od (OMG! Ubuntu!)[/URL]

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I definitly see the Secret Agent, Commander Keen, and other Appogee influences there.

For what it's worth, I do know and have fond memories of Chips Challenge Brandon. ;)

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Who knows maybe people will give more help towards Wine (maybe the humble guys should think about donating ;)).

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You've never heard of Chip's Challenge?! I mean, Bionic Commando I get, not many people know that game, but I thought everyone know's Chip's Challenge!

[sarcasm there], you should really know Bionic Commando!

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If it works it works!

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Quoting: "liamdawe, post: 4395, member: 1"The thing is though, if games that use it sell well, then hopefully you would think people in future would program with Linux in mind for a native version, after all this is a game that has been out for a while.

Tacking on wine support after is better than 0 support in my eyes, i don't have to mess with any configs still, it all installs for me just like it would natively.

The way I look at this particular issue is that if Linux users are buying products using Wine, then that erodes the potential customer base. From a publishing standpoint, if people on Linux have the ability to use Wine, then that's that market's needs met. If Wine can be seen as a legitimate option that consumers are happy with, then native support will be significantly harder to justify.

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Hm, I've never heard of either of those games before. I'll have to google them.

My inspiration for the Dirk Dashing games was mainly Apogee's Secret Agent and id's Commander Keen (2 of my favorite platformer series of games), plus bits from Bio Menace, Crystal Caves, Duke Nukem (the old 2D platformers), Mega Man, etc and a few ideas of my own.

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Quoting: "liamdawe, post: 4395, member: 1"The thing is though, if games that use it sell well, then hopefully you would think people in future would program with Linux in mind for a native version, after all this is a game that has been out for a while.

Another small point to add to this is that, when you consider it fully, we are not actually gaining anything from this but are in fact actually losing something we already had. Instead of just gaining pseudo-support from one developer (as this implies) we are actually potentially losing full support from the Humble Bundle for other titles in the future. It used to seem be native assured, but now this throws that into question.

So why should we let ourselves lose what we already had?

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Quoting: "liamdawe, post: 4405, member: 1"As far as I know no petition for Linux gaming has ever done anything?

I honestly do not know what kind of effect this will have, but it is not like most Linux gaming petitions. It is directed at Humble Bundle, who do have a history of listening, even to a single individual.

I just figured it was better to get organized rather than have islands of unrest in a large humble sea.

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Quoting: "st23, post: 4404"Wine = WINdows Emulator

"Now, yes, but until 1998, no: [URL='http://www.faqs.org/faqs/windows-emulation/wine-faq/']http://www.faqs.org/faqs/windows-emulation/wine-faq/[/URL]

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http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1931801&page=2

Okay? Fortunately it's not 1998. And wine is not an emulator any more than mono or java is an emulator.

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Quoting: "Hamish, post: 4403, member: 6"Maybe try using a different program, and if that does not work it is probably time to contact support.

duh..... 7z x psychonauts-linux-05312012.zip worked without issue... thanks, but should have thought about that myself :)

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Nice, like Bionic Commando meats Chips Challenge.

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Quoting: "liamdawe, post: 4405, member: 1"Like I said I feel it is better than nothing, but not the ideal solution.

As far as I know no petition for Linux gaming has ever done anything?

I think you forgot about Tibia Client Petition

http://www.linuxgames.com/?s=tibia

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Quoting: "Hamish, post: 4398, member: 6"The thing is Liam, aren't we beyond that stage these days? Especially from something like the Humble Indie Bundle?

I don't know how much good this will do, but I started a petition to protest the inclusion of a non-native game in a Humble Indie Bundle:
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/hib-native/

Please add your signatures. It is worded in a very constructive way and it seemed like the most civil way to get our point across.

We can not sell out our values at this stage. Not when we have momentum.

Like I said I feel it is better than nothing, but not the ideal solution.

As far as I know no petition for Linux gaming has ever done anything?

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Quoting: "Brandon Smith, post: 4399, member: 56"I thought WINE meant Wine Is Not an Emulator

Wine = WINdows Emulator

"Now, yes, but until 1998, no: [URL='http://www.faqs.org/faqs/windows-emulation/wine-faq/']http://www.faqs.org/faqs/windows-emulation/wine-faq/[/URL] "

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1931801&page=2

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Maybe try using a different program, and if that does not work it is probably time to contact support.

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any clue on this:

/Desktop/Downloaded> md5sum psychonauts-linux-05312012.zip
feb1d3216bbe32a317ea80cb4f88dcae psychonauts-linux-05312012.zip

checksum is correct

/Desktop/Downloaded> unzip psychonauts-linux-05312012.zip
Archive: psychonauts-linux-05312012.zip
fatal error: read failure while seeking for End-of-centdir-64 signature.
This zipfile is corrupt.
unzip: cannot find zipfile directory in one of psychonauts-linux-05312012.zip or
psychonauts-linux-05312012.zip.zip, and cannot find psychonauts-linux-05312012.zip.ZIP, period.

I downloaded the 4gb twice now and the checksum is correct so ????

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Indeed, you are right Brandon that WINE is not an emulator.

It does not really change anything though. As a Linux developer yourself, you deserve credit for the work you put into your native ports. By including a non-native game in something like the Bundle, it really is a kick in your teeth as well.

It is saying that you can get away with not putting in the effort.

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The petition is a good idea. But just to be sure they receive my complaint, I will also write to: [email protected]

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I thought WINE meant Wine Is Not an Emulator

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The thing is Liam, aren't we beyond that stage these days? Especially from something like the Humble Indie Bundle?

I don't know how much good this will do, but I started a petition to protest the inclusion of a non-native game in a Humble Indie Bundle:
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/hib-native/

Please add your signatures. It is worded in a very constructive way and it seemed like the most civil way to get our point across.

We can not sell out our values at this stage. Not when we have momentum.

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