Larian Studios Working On A New Game While Divinity: Original Sin Is Still Not On Linux

Quoting: adolsonAt the end of the day, I hope we all have learned that Kickstarter is just another form of pre-ordering, which by itself is stupid and very pointless in the digital age, except with the added risk of having paid real money for vaporware. Especially when we're talking about a Linux version. Stop paying for games before they're done! This is the the only lesson to take home from this and other situations like it. The sooner we realize this, the better. Crowdfunding seems like a good idea in theory, and when it's done by responsible parties, it is good. But there are all too often projects like this that fail to deliver or delay delivery for so long that you may as well have never contributed in the first place, and just waited for one of the twenty bargain-bin sales that passed between the Windows release and the Linux port, and you can never tell which company is going to fail you and which will hold up their end of the rather sweet deal they got, until it's too late.

Without crowdfunding, we wouldn't have excellent games like Pillars of Eternity or Shadowrun Dragonfall. So no, I'll keep donating to projects I find interesting.

Thank God I didn't support them.

Quoting: ZeitgeistWhen a game is promised to have linux support the GOL community has to ask if the game renderer will be OpenGL. D3D is a no go for us.

Then you'll remain with no games at all as all developers target D3D in first place. There only two games from Kickstarter that using OpenGL on Windows: Broken Age and Planetary Annihilation.

And yeah problem with Larian's wasn't OpenGL, but shitty Audiokinetic Wwise middleware. So you better ask developers if they using any middleware without source code and Linux support.

I'm worn out "being fair" for negligent developers that renege on their promises of Linux ports. Indeed, I've developed an attitude of bitter suspicion about any promised Linux port. I've had to develop a mindset that NO game is ever COMING to Linux. It is either available on Linux, or it is not. It is simply infuriating and belittling the glibness with which developers promise ports and then walk away from their promises. It is simply wrong.

I fully understand that "things happen" in a project, but common decency, basic human interaction dictates that if you make a promise, you better explain yourself when you fail to deliver on that promise. By making excuses on behalf of silent developers that fail to deliver on their projects, the Linux community condones and validates the abuse it receives. I don't see how the Linux gaming community benefits at all by enabling the shoddy business practices of what amounts to, at best, negligence and the silent treatment, and at worst mismanagement and poor planning or an utter lack of play-testing or quality control.

So yes, I fully support a "wall of shame," not for games, but for their would-be Linux developers. If they fail to release on time and also fail to explain why and offer a new expected time, then up on the wall. If they push out some stillborn, broken port, then up on the wall. No one is going to hold these snake-oil salesmen accountable for their lies and shoddy products, not Steam, not the Windows community, nobody but us. If we learned nothing from the recent Steam reversal regarding selling mods, we learned that businesses respond to the slings and arrows of an outraged community.

I'm done begging. I'm done going with hat in hand to these developers and thanking them for even deigning to bless us poor Linux users with the even the possibility of a port. If a person is only as good as their word, then many developers are simply bad, bad people.

Quoting: PicoboomI'm worn out "being fair" for negligent developers that renege on their promises of Linux ports. Indeed, I've developed an attitude of bitter suspicion about any promised Linux port. I've had to develop a mindset that NO game is ever COMING to Linux. It is either available on Linux, or it is not. It is simply infuriating and belittling the glibness with which developers promise ports and then walk away from their promises. It is simply wrong.

I fully understand that "things happen" in a project, but common decency, basic human interaction dictates that if you make a promise, you better explain yourself when you fail to deliver on that promise. By making excuses on behalf of silent developers that fail to deliver on their projects, the Linux community condones and validates the abuse it receives. I don't see how the Linux gaming community benefits at all by enabling the shoddy business practices of what amounts to, at best, negligence and the silent treatment, and at worst mismanagement and poor planning or an utter lack of play-testing or quality control.

So yes, I fully support a "wall of shame," not for games, but for their would-be Linux developers. If they fail to release on time and also fail to explain why and offer a new expected time, then up on the wall. If they push out some stillborn, broken port, then up on the wall. No one is going to hold these snake-oil salesmen accountable for their lies and shoddy products, not Steam, not the Windows community, nobody but us. If we learned nothing from the recent Steam reversal regarding selling mods, we learned that businesses respond to the slings and arrows of an outraged community.

I'm done begging. I'm done going with hat in hand to these developers and thanking them for even deigning to bless us poor Linux users with the even the possibility of a port. If a person is only as good as their word, then many developers are simply bad, bad people.

I still think this is a overreaction just b/c they are working on a new game before D:OS is on Linux. As I said earlier, chances are that they have a very small team of Linux specific Developers/Engineers working on the Linux version, they are not going to continue paying the entire company to do nothing while the Linux team completes their work. They are working on several Mac and Windows fixes and enhancements as well that I highly doubt are going to be thrown out either.

As for the length of time, unless you are working at Larian (or any company), do NOT blame the Developers/Engineers. It is never that simple. I'm speaking from experience here as a Linux Systems/DevOps Engineer. There are times when we have to do things we know are not the best option because mgmt requested it done a certain way, or times when we had to push back releases of major projects/features due to simple realizing the project as bigger more complicated that originally thought, and even times when we simply did NOT have the resources (either time or money) to focus on more than 2-3 major issues and other projects got put on hold.

All of the above is normal in business. If Larian has any sort of Board or Investors (outside of the crowdfunding), they may even be facing pressure from them to focus on the issues/tasks where they could lose the most money. I don't like how long it is taking either, but I've been in the tech industry long enough to know that it's never as simple as it seems. And they are still a business first and foremost. Linux Developers/Engineers are expensive, far more expensive than Windows devs are due to their relative scarcity and high need these days in the Corporate world. Face it, if Larian doesn't make money, we don't see a port anyway.

Quoting: EagleDelta

Quoting: PicoboomI'm worn out "being fair" for negligent developers that renege on their promises of Linux ports. Indeed, I've developed an attitude of bitter suspicion about any promised Linux port. I've had to develop a mindset that NO game is ever COMING to Linux. It is either available on Linux, or it is not. It is simply infuriating and belittling the glibness with which developers promise ports and then walk away from their promises. It is simply wrong.

I fully understand that "things happen" in a project, but common decency, basic human interaction dictates that if you make a promise, you better explain yourself when you fail to deliver on that promise. By making excuses on behalf of silent developers that fail to deliver on their projects, the Linux community condones and validates the abuse it receives. I don't see how the Linux gaming community benefits at all by enabling the shoddy business practices of what amounts to, at best, negligence and the silent treatment, and at worst mismanagement and poor planning or an utter lack of play-testing or quality control.

So yes, I fully support a "wall of shame," not for games, but for their would-be Linux developers. If they fail to release on time and also fail to explain why and offer a new expected time, then up on the wall. If they push out some stillborn, broken port, then up on the wall. No one is going to hold these snake-oil salesmen accountable for their lies and shoddy products, not Steam, not the Windows community, nobody but us. If we learned nothing from the recent Steam reversal regarding selling mods, we learned that businesses respond to the slings and arrows of an outraged community.

I'm done begging. I'm done going with hat in hand to these developers and thanking them for even deigning to bless us poor Linux users with the even the possibility of a port. If a person is only as good as their word, then many developers are simply bad, bad people.

I still think this is a overreaction just b/c they are working on a new game before D:OS is on Linux. As I said earlier, chances are that they have a very small team of Linux specific Developers/Engineers working on the Linux version, they are not going to continue paying the entire company to do nothing while the Linux team completes their work. They are working on several Mac and Windows fixes and enhancements as well that I highly doubt are going to be thrown out either.

As for the length of time, unless you are working at Larian (or any company), do NOT blame the Developers/Engineers. It is never that simple. I'm speaking from experience here as a Linux Systems/DevOps Engineer. There are times when we have to do things we know are not the best option because mgmt requested it done a certain way, or times when we had to push back releases of major projects/features due to simple realizing the project as bigger more complicated that originally thought, and even times when we simply did NOT have the resources (either time or money) to focus on more than 2-3 major issues and other projects got put on hold.

All of the above is normal in business. If Larian has any sort of Board or Investors (outside of the crowdfunding), they may even be facing pressure from them to focus on the issues/tasks where they could lose the most money. I don't like how long it is taking either, but I've been in the tech industry long enough to know that it's never as simple as it seems. And they are still a business first and foremost. Linux Developers/Engineers are expensive, far more expensive than Windows devs are due to their relative scarcity and high need these days in the Corporate world. Face it, if Larian doesn't make money, we don't see a port anyway.

THIS!

We should be glad that they made the approach of porting it in house.

It would be pretty bad practice of Larian to NOT be working on another title, they got a company to run.

I did help the KS and am pissed its taking so long, but to make such a big subject about it because they thinking about the future is a bit silly to say the least

In-house Linux versions are great but here is something fishy obviously.
Having two developers working on the Linux target and not getting
something to ship in this long time shows that they are either lacking the
required skills (sorry) or that there are serious technical issues with the engine.

I bet Icculus alone would have ported that thing already (or it is practically not portable).

Added Larian's reply to the top of the article. I am curious to see what their information to come soon is, and how soon that is exactly.

The thing that has always bothered me is the lack of updates. Those like me who backed this game remember the update song well, as Larian was amazing at keeping in touch and letting people know what was going on... until they weren't.

Once it was released for Window and Max, Linux port in a state of silence. No updates for a very long time then the middleware issue came to light as well as a branch issue. Delays and issues, while unfortunate do happen but this is a very long wait, and as others have said it has seemed bigger games getting ported by 1 person seem to come out much faster.

I keep holding my breath and do appreciate when updates are given about the Linux port. I just wish they would keep in touch better.

As for as being upset over the time, at this point I am utterly defeated and can't even attempt to get angry I am all dried up over this one.