ZeniMax are flexing their legal muscles towards DoomRL

Quoting: liamdaweThat effectively shuts it down. The entire project is entirely based around Doom as a fan project.

Not really. In the short term just have to remove the meta-tags, images and references, in the long term change the name of it. Just like Tales of Middle Earth became Tales of Maj'Eyal.

FreedoomRL?

All the replacement graphics he would need are there.

On the one hand, Zenimax, as loathsome a company as they are, are completely in the legal right here. On the other hand, a company with a soul would let this go, or even give it its blessing, as DoomRL is in no way hurting their bottom line nor the image of the IP. They could even use giving DoomRL their blessing as a bit of positive PR, but they didn't because that's not how the soulless suits at Zenimax think.


Last edited by Keyrock on 2 December 2016 at 4:59 pm UTC

I usually like the biased tone of GamingOnLinux, it gives character to the site and its authors.

But this is one of the articles that get over the tipping point for me. OK, it could have been even worse with a clickbait topic like "DoomRL is doomed!!!1!", but it is still strongly opinionated in both the article itself as well as Liam defending his point of view down here in the comments.

Yes, such a legal letter is a threat if it is targeted at something that makes you earn the money for your living. But it is not threatening to take the site and the game(s) down at all. They just don't want their trademarks to be used by someone else. If Kornel Kisielewicz and Mossmouth change the name of the new project and other trademarked properties like the Doom logo, the demands of this letter are well fulfilled and both the site and the game will just continue.

Repeat: Zenimax is not trying to end the site and the game! They just don't want the DoomRL guys to use branded properties they don't own or licensed to use.

Kornel and Derek will have to change names, graphics if their work and probably even their subdomain (doom.chaosforge.org) and that's about it. This will not be the end of anything, it just gets a different name and a slightly different look. Hell, most game projects undergo such changes, it's just that the public might not know about it, the press not writing about it and the reasons might be different. But changing the name of a game or graphics or even art style or whatever is nothing to worry about in the biz.

Yes, it is noteworthy. Yes, we should all know so that we can update our inner radar and our bookmarks.

But it is not the death of a project or a website. And it is not proof of big bad corporates crushing the small heralded indie developer.

And even if this turns out to be the point of no return for them and they decide to call quits, the project might have faced other difficulties in the first place and not just this one.


Last edited by Gobo on 2 December 2016 at 7:03 pm UTC

QuoteThat effectively shuts it down. The entire project is entirely based around Doom as a fan project.

I've read the EFF links posted by another user, and apologize for my lack of clarity on the law, but it does seem like this is a case where they should enforce the trademark, just to avoid confusion.

If the only value of the project is the reflected quality of Doom itself, and the project cannot stand on its own merits with replaced names and logos, then I don't have a lot of sympathy for it.

I appreciate that this is a labor of love, but Zenimax is not telling them to cease all development, just to make their work their own.

Seems to me that even if they are worried (whether accurately or not) about the consequences of not defending their trademark, they could say to the fanfolks "Tell you what, we'll license the trademark to you for a buck." All properly licensed, problem solved.

Quoting: ajgp

Quoting: MyeulCThis serious misconception needs to DIE FAST:
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/11/ubuntus-trademark-folly-fueled-by-misunderstanding-of-law-eff-says/
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2013/11/trademark-law-does-not-require-companies-tirelessly-censor-internet (via the previous link)

Im happy to be corrected, as I say it was only based on information that I could remember. I will of course read the links when I have a bit of spare time

No problem. I just tried to rush a bit not to be buried behind 10 pages of comments. This is quite a common misconception, unfortunately. I wasn't sure what to think about it myself before reading the aforementioned blog post; it's quite an interesting (And not too boring) read.

Edit, just to clarify a bit: I am not saying zenimax don't have the right to do this, I am not a lawyer either :) . Plus, I am not familiar with the project at all, and couldn't say if they are a commercial endeavour of some sort or not. I was merely trying to debunk the misconception that trademarks *had* to be enforced to remain valid.
That said, as it was pointed out in the comment, licensing might be an option, although I doubt it will happen so soon after a fresh reboot of the franchise.


Last edited by MayeulC on 2 December 2016 at 8:44 pm UTC

Quoting: KeyrockOn the one hand, Zenimax, as loathsome a company as they are, are completely in the legal right here. On the other hand, a company with a soul would let this go, or even give it its blessing, as DoomRL is in no way hurting their bottom line nor the image of the IP. They could even use giving DoomRL their blessing as a bit of positive PR, but they didn't because that's not how the soulless suits at Zenimax think.

My thoughts exactly. No need for me to chime in, you said it all sir. :)

Quoting: GoboI usually like the biased tone of GamingOnLinux, it gives character to the site and its authors.

But this is one of the articles that get over the tipping point for me. OK, it could have been even worse with a clickbait topic like "DoomRL is doomed!!!1!", but it is still strongly opinionated in both the article itself as well as Liam defending his point of view down here in the comments. *snip*

Since I never did reply to this (not sure I ever actually saw this comment before), I wanted to make something clear. I absolutely never, ever, mean to do any kind of clickbait. This was simply me getting ahead of myself at the time about it.

I've also adjusted the title with that in mind.