DXVK, a Vulkan-based compatibility layer for Direct3D 11 for use with Wine

Quoting: jensSorry, your discussed quite well till now, but this is just nonsense ;). There are valid reason for dual booting and valid reasons for wine. Both usages should be debatable without excluding one due to the other.

PS: According to his profile @Leopard does not dual boot ;)

It's not so much about reasons, as about critics who don't use Wine, but dualboot. if @Leopard doesn't - good for him.


Last edited by Shmerl on 26 March 2018 at 10:03 pm UTC

Quoting: Shmerl

Quoting: LeopardI'm not a dual booter?

That doesn't need to apply specifically to you, but to anyone who doalboots. They have several options. Either find replacement for what they use on Windows natively, or if they can't run it in Wine. The worse one is to continue dual booting.

So you're basically saying as long as you don't have to use , you're willing to feed your hated Windows market?

Wow , your logic is just... I'm speechless right now... Wow , just wow...

Anyway , let's give it a go to Witcher3 on DxVK with a not-legit copy. Shall we?

Oh , wait. Yes , with Wine evolving you can feed more and more your beloved , non Linux caring platform GOG. With buying more and more Windows games.

I think this site and reddit Linux gaming needs to change their name to "Gaming on Wine , a true Windows backyard or a little bit spinoff".

Quoting: LeopardSo you're basically saying as long as you don't have to use , you're willing to feed your hated Windows market?

I'm saying that as long as you are using Windows, you are feeding the Windows market. Then, if you buy recent Windows only game - you are not expressing interest in Linux version for that developer. That's why I personally avoid it. But that's not what's feeding the Windows market. Usage of Windows does.


Last edited by Shmerl on 26 March 2018 at 10:15 pm UTC

Quoting: Shmerl

Quoting: LeopardSo you're basically saying as long as you don't have to use , you're willing to feed your hated Windows market?

I'm saying that as long as you are using Windows, you are feeding the Windows market. Then, if you buy recent Windows only game - you are not expressing interest in Linux version for that developer. That's why I personally avoid it. But that's not what's feeding the Windows market. Usage of Windows does.

Dude , your logic is really out of the roof.

Windows is there today , strongest. Why? Because of it's apps. Why there are so many apps on there? Because people buying it.

Oh , wait a minute. That is the part where your logic blows. You're in these statics too Shmerl. Like others , you bought a Windows only product.

So , like a sane person devs would count you and Wine users as a Windows user. Because ; for example : If a man goes to a game store and bought a PS3 game , logic says customer must have bought it for PS3 , right? Because it is compatible with it , not with Xbox or PC right?

So shop owner would say : Hey , these PS3 games actually selling very good. I should order much more for these.

However you only bought this game to dump a legit copy for RPCS3 in order to play it?

Shmerl , you're better than this.


Last edited by Leopard on 26 March 2018 at 10:27 pm UTC

Quoting: LeopardWindows is there today , strongest. Why? Because of it's apps.

Nope, you missed it right there. For the vast majority of users, Windows offers nothing that Linux can't. That doesn't stop Windows from being most used. It's most used because people are programmed to use it, by PC manufacturers bundling Windows everywhere by default, and people buying what's installed. That's about it. Cases of people needing Windows only stuff that doesn't work on Linux are a minority.


Last edited by Shmerl on 26 March 2018 at 10:31 pm UTC

Quoting: Shmerl

Quoting: LeopardWindows is there today , strongest. Why? Because of it's apps.

Nope, you missed it right there. For the vast majority of users, Windows offers nothing that Linux can't. That doesn't stop Windows from being most used. It's most used because people are programmed to use it, by PC manufacturers bundling Windows everywhere. That's about it. Cases of people needing Windows only stuff that doesn't work on Linux are a minority.

No , there is a huge difference at yours Linux "can't" point of view and mine also.

Native support for these apps.

People you described as "programmed to use Windows" are average Joe's mostly , they even barely use Windows.

Your offering is this : You can do this also on Linux. On Windows it is two click away , on Linux go there , do that x , apply that y , compile that z , fiddle lit bit with you mouse ( gotta love the mouse ) etc.

They can't do this. They need to install things like what they did on Windows. With Wine and offerings like these , it is not possible. Onlymarkets like Steam or GOG can provide these with native builds. Not with Wine.

Any questions?

For most cases you don't need that. Linux works out of the box for the "average Joe".

Quoting: ShmerlFor most cases you don't need that. Linux works out of the box for the "average Joe".

No , it is not. Some simple examples:
When you use your monitor with dvi to vga adaptor or a similar one ; it won't be able to detect your monitor res. ( Windows detects it correctly btw )

Minute 1 , goal 1. Welcome to the world of terminal.

If you have a Realtek wi fi chip , welcome to the world of terminal.

Screen tearings everywhere? Welcome to the world of terminal.

You have to configure your gaming periphals? Welcome to the world of terminal.


So adding top of these , Wine usage? C'mon , Wine is not a solution. For a newcomer , only outcome is native games.

Quoting: LeopardWhen you use your monitor with dvi to vga adaptor or a similar one ; it won't be able to detect your monitor res. ( Windows detects it correctly btw )

Good luck with that. I saw enough horror stories with monitor detection on Windows, when you use analog ones (VGA). If you want to save your sanity, don't use VGA to begin with.

Quoting: LeopardIf you have a Realtek wi fi chip , welcome to the world of terminal.

Realtek chips are quite poor in general, even on Windows. Use Intel.

Quoting: LeopardScreen tearings everywhere?

Sure, don't use blobs (hello Nvidia users). Problem solved.

Quoting: LeopardYou have to configure your gaming periphals?

Quite a minority case, most don't have any such peripherals. And gamers who have, are ready to configure them as needed. Gaming on Linux is a special case, we were talking about average Joe, and that doesn't mean gamers.


Last edited by Shmerl on 26 March 2018 at 11:51 pm UTC

In a sense your both right.

Yes, using Windows whether dual booting or exclusively will count towards the Windows market statistics, simple as that. So far as stats are concerned that's another Windows computer on the internet.

Purchasing Windows software, be it games or applications will also count towards Windows market share statistics even if used in Wine, as far as stats are concerned that's another piece of Windows software sold.

The only way to not add to the Windows statistics is to not use any Windows software, whether by dual boot or by wine.

As for ease of use, Linux can be both easy and not easy to use. For example if you stick Mint on an average computer it will almost certainly "work out of the box". But if said computer has strange hardware or specific requirements it may not work. While in most cases it would, there is the odd case that it will not.

But let us not forget however that Windows also suffers from this problem. In many cases with Windows it may not work out of the box, you may need to search the internet for drivers, or use a provided CD. It's those additional drivers which are making it work. But since they are not included by default with Windows technically it does not "work out the box" as further additional drivers and configuration are required.

Sometimes that device can be a network device, and if you haven't got the CD that can be a pain in the backside to get the driver for. Just like it would be with Linux.

In the event it does not work on Linux this almost certainly means the manufacture didn't do for Linux what they did for Windows, that is make a driver. But 9 times out of 10 you can find a driver somewhere for it. This would require additional configuration, but then so does Windows in some cases.

I remember having a Realtek ethernet port which would not work with the stock kernel, I had to go to Realtek's website and install their driver. But that is again effectively the same as on Windows having to insert the CD or download the driver.

Sure on Linux you may have to use command line, but often you can just copy and paste commands for stuff like that, and in many cases kmod packages exist which do it for you, which you can install from your package manager (Like the nvidia ones).

It has been a very long time however since I put Linux on a computer and it didn't work.