Facepunch are no longer selling the Linux version of the survival game Rust (updated)

Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: Whitewolfe80As for the throw away community line we have this every so often it goes back to once again the linux die hards that think they throw f bombs and act like Stallman or Linus.

1. No it does not.
2. Had it occurred to you that that is, itself, a rather inflammatory and offensive comment?
3. Do you in fact have any idea how Stallman acts?

Yes because I have twitter and if he rants about open source one more time his neck is going to fall off or he will have a heart attack. Sorry we strongly disagree on this point and it does its is the guys that idenfy as linux hardcore are the worst. Feedback to developers strongly welcome not tweets like "learn to linux your game is shit" that is an actual tweet that took me 10 seconds to find on twitter

sad news for the Linux players of the game.

i play some truly excellent Unity games on Steam and i hope this is not going to become a trend moving forward for new Unity games running on Linux

Quoting: iiari1) Only the Linux community is toxic (eyeroll). Has he been in, well, almost any other Windows gaming forum at all for the sophomoric, hateful, entitled views there? Hahahaha....

Based on my own experience, this is my conclusion...

For some developers eyes (not pointing on Facepunch or anyone), Linux gaming community rank is lower than Windows pirates.
Hell, for some developers (again not pointing on anyone), they rather Linux gamers pirating their Windows games and play on Wine than developing their games to run on Linux natively.

FYI, only significant minority developers act like that (please pirating my games, I don't do Linux). Majority of them love to support Linux, just sometimes some of them (not all) underestimate the Linux difficulties.

Just read Steam community posts or send private e-mail to developers. You'll get it.

Quoting: GuestI think the Stallman I've "seen" (interviews, reading material, etc), and the one you just described, are two different people.
Stallman is very careful and considered with his words, measured and reasoning. I think a few more people acting like that would be a good thing.

The Stallman I know would never ever use twitter. So I don't know what that guy was smoking.
Stallman has always been very pragmatic, and the worst thing he ever said was POSIX_ME_HARDER, and he was right about that.
I do acknowledge that the linux community contains the same salty persons the windows community has: demanding, feeling superior and totally without respect.
That's not a problem with our community, but a problem with humanity. But since we are the underdog, any such a person should not be in our community, or should be silenced.
I even was surprised that a major open source developer was playing Ark: Survival Evolved, and had the same idea as I about it: It's an amazing game, and who cares that the graphics are less than on windows, just as long as you can enter a cave. No hate, no whining. Just totally ok because he could game, and he could do his work.

Quoting: ArdjeThe Stallman I know would never ever use twitter.

Little bit correction... Mr. Stallman did have and use Twitter..
But not like most other Twitter users (like tweeting 24/7). He used it for website that need Twitter account for commenting.

His twitter handler: @rmspostcomments

Reason he'd open Twitter account

ADD: Also from his website... How I do my Computing (stallman.org)

QuoteI have a Twitter account called rmspostcomments, which I use to log in on other sites to post comments on articles. I never post on Twitter. Someone made an account stallman_feed which I'm told posts something about my political notes. Any other Twitter account that claims to be mine is an impostor.

Last edited by tonR on 29 July 2018 at 10:56 pm UTC

Quoting: Whitewolfe80But my point is it doesnt matter how much Torvalds rant have a reason you cant rant period not in public feel free to say what you want behind closed doors i know people love he is blunt but business world that is a no go and it scares away big fish

Your point is that we should shut the fuck up so nobody gets angry or scared with our comments? Do you think that the best way to handle the manners and lies of this guy is not saying anything and apologysing with him about how bad he feels about our community? Really? Is that what you meant?

We can discuss a lot the manners, but this guy doesn't have ones so it's pointless. So, I don't see why we have to accept this treatment from this idiot as we don't deserve it and there is no reason to keep our mouth close. Also, we're a community of people that many times buys games just to support a developer. Many of us buys games even when they aren't out type or we don't have the time to play, but we buy them anyway just to show support a let the ones that have the time to play it on Linux. I really would like to know how this behavior could scares away the big fishes.

It's not what we say, it's more about being careful to whom we give our money.

No big loss as i stopped playing it because of the toxic community and running bad on mesa drivers.

I refuse to accept the accusation about the "Linux Community being abusive, demanding and rude"! This is a blatant generalization. I am sure that there are some people from the "Linux Community" who are like that. There are also people from the Windows, PlayStation, XBox, Nintendo, you name it, communities who are like that. It doesn't mean that the community as a whole is like that.

For me this accusation is nothing more than an attempt to shift the blame. "Blunt and sarcastic" it is not.

Quoting: ivantI refuse to accept the accusation about the "Linux Community being abusive, demanding and rude"! This is a blatant generalization. I am sure that there are some people from the "Linux Community" who are like that. There are also people from the Windows, PlayStation, XBox, Nintendo, you name it, communities who are like that. It doesn't mean that the community as a whole is like that.

For me this accusation is nothing more than an attempt to shift the blame. "Blunt and sarcastic" it is not.

Garry has always been a big baby when it comes to Linux since he failed to install Ubuntu on his pc and claimed that Linux was the worst because he doesn't know how to make it work. He didn't even think about trying something else or that maby it was his hardware's fault. I could only find this: https://twitter.com/garrynewman/status/334249677992103936 But i remember he made an article talking so much shit it was so sad... People should not support this guy he is not worth it at all. He doesn't even know how to debug and he call himself a developer...


Last edited by TraKz on 30 July 2018 at 10:25 am UTC

To be honest, with the Unity Linux bugs for release versions for the past half year, I can understand that decision. I wouldn't be surprised if others with in development games would do the same until Unity Linux QA improves somewhat. I wonder if the community could more easily contribute to that.

Very upsetting, especially since there are not that many popular survival games for Linux.. And the Unity problems, I had to switch to a different engine because of how hideous it is on Linux, so that's at least in some way a good point, though they got the guy from feral now so really hoping on improvement.. Though that's still developers responsibility, they chose the engine.

As for their complaints about the Linux community, I think it's very unfair, a vast majority of developers ignore and deem unworthy Linux community, and we just have to deal with hearing how useless it would be to consider us, yet they expect us to be nice in return. Of course, everyone should be nice to each other, but in this case it would be one way. I've contacted so many developers with my brother asking about Linux version, but they couldn't care less about it.

The way I see it, as a video game developer myself, Linux should be a supported platform out of the box, since I don't even understand why would they ise anything else for development.

He's basically saying that Linux users don't deserve support because he doesn't like our attitude. Hard not to take that personally.

Another scam from a scam developer. I knew this game was a bad bet when they blew through their initial Kickstarter and Early Access funds in two-years with nothing to show for it and then asked customers to double-down with a second donation so they could start again from scratch. Anybody with any sense will stay far away from this trash.

Quoting: Whitewolfe80

Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: Whitewolfe80As for the throw away community line we have this every so often it goes back to once again the linux die hards that think they throw f bombs and act like Stallman or Linus.

1. No it does not.
2. Had it occurred to you that that is, itself, a rather inflammatory and offensive comment?
3. Do you in fact have any idea how Stallman acts?

Yes because I have twitter and if he rants about open source one more time his neck is going to fall off or he will have a heart attack. Sorry we strongly disagree on this point and it does its is the guys that idenfy as linux hardcore are the worst. Feedback to developers strongly welcome not tweets like "learn to linux your game is shit" that is an actual tweet that took me 10 seconds to find on twitter

I frankly find it hard to believe that Richard Stallman would use Twitter, which is after all a proprietary platform. Plus it really doesn't suit his communication style--like me, he's too wordy. So if you have seen someone who purports to be Richard Stallman using Twitter, I think you have been deceived.
Edited to add: Apparently he does in a very limited way (thanks, tonR). But for practical purposes, no.
But I'll admit I may have somewhat misinterpreted your initial post. Your mention of learning from Stallman made it seem as if you were intending "linux die hards" to mean people who were politically big on Free/Libre Software, or mostly those people. But your quoted tweet obviously isn't remotely that kind of person, it's just the Linux equivalent of Mac types who say Windows Suxxorz or whatever--people who are extreme for their team, with no real content; it's just like rooting for your sports franchise. So perhaps you were not trying to say what it seemed you were trying to say.
However, you're still wrong. Every OS, every thing in existence where people can choose this or that, has people who are fanatical for the team. People dissing the Linux community do not do so because Linux does not miraculously lack that contingent. And it certainly has nothing to do with Richard Stallman. Linus . . . well, maybe a little, but not really. He doesn't always set the greatest example on temperate speech, but gamers can be profane without learning from Linus. Most of those people have no idea what Linus has ever said.


Last edited by Purple Library Guy on 30 July 2018 at 6:00 pm UTC

This very thread has done a good job of demonstrating to me just how toxic members of the Linux gaming community are.

Here's a few points:

- Most of the complainants neither bought nor played the game, and have no investment in it whatsoever. (So why comment? Answer: Because you're a troll.)
- Game developers do not like bad publicity, and if the Linux community is going to be toxic about their port or delayed build, then they might as well not have a Linux port. Better to have a perfect Windows release and Console release than even put any effort into Linux (which is what many of the AAA Studios do).
- Why not express anger about companies like Bethesda and Rockstar who never brought ANY of their titles to Linux? (That's right: Have a good old moan at the company which did bother bringing the game to Linux, and has been doing okay with updates.)
- So what if head of Facepunch makes some digs at Linux and Linux community. He makes digs at everything. It should be a case of "Water off a duck's back", i.e. It's nothing, and it shouldn't bother you.
- Rust game has been working fine on Linux (at least as good as the Windows version) ever since it went Final Release. And it was working pretty good before that, on Linux, too.

It's all okay though, because you can spend your money buying Windows games and then play them on WINE, making the Linux community look even smaller than it is.


Last edited by g000h on 30 July 2018 at 5:55 pm UTC

Quoting: nitroflow

Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: nitroflow

Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: rapakivBut I never seen so much hate in GOL as in this thread, relax, life is short, enjoy it

Hate? Really?! What bemuses me about this discussion actually is that the reaction is more extreme than the dislike of the actual developer. I don't really have a dog in this fight.

Really? What boggles my mind is that all the negativity comes from people that don't have a dog on this fight. The people that actually do play the game are understanding and sympathetic to the dev's decision, go figure...

Hrm. First, I notice you've redefined how I was using that phrase, such that your comment probably would have been better as a standalone than a reply to me.
Second, really? Have you been reading the same thread I have? I'd say it's pretty clear that some of the people who are bothered are in fact people who play the game. Others aren't, but your point is simply wrong. Also meant to be snide, far as I can tell. You can contribute to or detract from a conversation in two ways, content or tone; pity you chose to subtract on both fronts.

I've been very much reading the same thread, I believe, and the comment wasn't meant to be snide. It's really my take on this thread.

I replied to you because I do agree with you about this being an extreme reaction but that's not really what I find surprising at all, it's the people that don't seem to have the game(or if they have it they don't mention it anywhere) and the ones that were planning to buy it(which they still can), that are behind this extremism.

In hindsight I should have expanded on the "go figure...", what I meant by it was that those who have mentioned playing it actively are aware of the issues and thus have a better understanding of things, that's why they aren't crying bloody murder, unlike mostly everyone else.

PS: This whole reaction also started before the devs had a chance to comment on this.

Sorry I took it the wrong way and for coming down on you. Since I myself do not own the game and had mentioned as much, your comment felt somewhat like an attack, but I see that wasn't the intent.

Overall, my personal take is that on substance, the move seems fair enough, but in terms of how it was handled I'm unimpressed, both the initial failure to communicate and the whiny stuff about the Linux community.

I think what some businesspeople need to internalize is that customers, of any stripe whether Linux users or people buying carrots, fundamentally have little trust for the people selling to them, since they are aware that the point of the exercise is simply to gain as much of their money as possible for as little expense as possible. Unlike in normal personal interactions, as a business you have no benefit of the doubt--the base assumption, for good reason, is that you're probably trying to scam them some way. Therefore if you want people not to suspect you're pulling a fast one, you have to make extra efforts to communicate well and clearly just what you are doing when you make a move that affects them. This goes double for businesses operating at longer distances, online and such, where customers have no way to storm into your office and hold you to account and so have all the more reason for suspicion.

Quoting: Guest

Quoting: Mountain ManAnother scam from a scam developer. I knew this game was a bad bet when they blew through their initial Kickstarter and Early Access funds in two-years with nothing to show for it and then asked customers to double-down with a second donation so they could start again from scratch. Anybody with any sense will stay far away from this trash.

How exactly is it a scam ? They have simply discontinued Linux support.. but they havent taken away the existing Linux builds.
Or are you just throwing abuse at the developer, which um.. is exactly what he's complained about?

They haven't even taken away Linux support (as in updates). Just the store icon.

Quoting: g000hThis very thread has done a good job of demonstrating to me just how toxic members of the Linux gaming community are.

Here's a few points:

- Most of the complainants neither bought nor played the game, and have no investment in it whatsoever. (So why comment? Answer: Because you're a troll.)

Hmmm, yes, toxic, you make a good point. Like, calling everyone (such as specifically me) trolls. That does seem toxic.

Quoting: burningserenity

Quoting: F.Ultra

Quoting: Egonaut

Quoting: nox

Quoting: EgonautThat's why you don't support that toxic guy Garry and everyone who's working with him.

Meh, he is straight forward, blunt and sarcastic. Toxic isn't really the right word.

Calling Linux (and by that their users) a second class isn't toxic? Yeah sure, defend that guy further if you want, I don't.

But he is correct, the Linux version is a second class citizen for them. There is nothing toxic with that, second class citizen in computer speak only means that it's a lower priority, it's not a derogatory term.

Here's an idea: by the dev's admission, only 17 people use Linux. So why not just give us the source code? No one else can be bothered to compile it. Hell, if we give him $240 he'll even get to keep the money from the lost sales!

It's note like there is a source of The Linux Version that is also not The Windows Version. I get what you are saying but this will never happen, there are several examples of publishers that rather see zero sales than earn some money by selling a license or source code.

Quoting: iiariI have zero horse in the this race, but find it hilarious that the dev implies that:

1) Only the Linux community is toxic (eyeroll). Has he been in, well, almost any other Windows gaming forum at all for the sophomoric, hateful, entitled views there? Hahahaha....

2) Only Linux is a broken platform (eyeroll again). There are so many broken games, compromised engines, etc etc on Windows and, well, every other platform that to pretend it's only us is absurd.

This is because Gary is a Windows guy, he codes on Windows and he uses only Windows. So when he sees toxic comments from Windows people he is just not seeing it but then the same comes from a Linux user then it hits his brain with "well look at that, another toxic Linux luser...".

This is just how the human brain works. If you are a meat-eater and you see a single Vegan doing something crazy -> all vegans are crazy. And if you are a die hard Linux fan then you can experience one bug every single day without recording it but try Windows/macOS once and hit a single bug and "I knew it, this whole system is FUBAR".