Valve have some serious competition, with the Epic Games Store being announced

Quoting: liamdaweBlizzard don't support Linux

But they do have some Linux-friendly devs (or at least used to - the creator of SDL was there for a while). Rumors have it there were native Linux ports of some of their games, but corporate did not want to release them, even as unsupported builds.

Quoting: Phlebiac

Quoting: liamdaweBlizzard don't support Linux

But they do have some Linux-friendly devs (or at least used to - the creator of SDL was there for a while). Rumors have it there were native Linux ports of some of their games, but corporate did not want to release them, even as unsupported builds.

Sure. So...they don't support Linux. ;)

Quoting: liamdaweSo...they don't support Linux. ;)

Not disagreeing! But apparently they have made changes multiple times to improve compatibility with WINE.

I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand, yeah, competition is never bad. It kicks the others bum and makes them move.

On the other hand, Valve is moving. They do things. In the background. Proton was in the works for over two years, without telling anybody. Valve tries new things, they invented Steam Machines, Steam OS, Steam Controller, Steam Link, Steam VR. But everything they do is a slow start, not hard pushing anything. This sometimes doesn't work out well. Steam Machines haven't been successful, Steam Link stopped production... I'm happy they still show commitment to Linux development, because they are the only ones really giving Linux gaming a platform. Sure there is GoG and itch. But most (Linux) games are on Steam.

So, now Epic launches their store... and why? Because they get lots of money from Fortnite and have enough money to try it. And what's their deal? Taking a significant lower cut than the other stores do. This does look appealing on the first sight, but they need to stick to it, to be successful. Also when the first start might not work out well.

Unfortunately, Epic doesn't show much commitment to Linux development. Sure, Unreal Engine 4 does support Linux. But looking at Everspace, they still struggle with each patch (atm we have to wait for patch 1.3.3). Also supporting the Linux version is still a loss-making business from them. I thought it would have sold better on Linux, but it didn't. They are far away from break even. The Mac version was way more profitable than the Linux version :-/ And Apple is even kinda working against being their platform a gaming platform.

Seeing this, I'm afraid that Rockfish might not support Linux with their next project, and probably other devs might not even consider doing a Linux build if they have to put in so much effort to create a Linux version or maintain upcoming patches.

Though reading about other "open platforms" and smilies/emojis in Tim Sweeney's tweets regarding Linux support might give hope... it's just that... hope. Afaik Valve has the biggest user base atm, so they won't struggle anytime soon. But if Epic manages to get a critical mass, devs might primarily publish on their store, and then not having a Linux client... go figure.

Linux still is a niche. Still more than 99% are not using Linux as gaming platform. Unfortunately. We can be so happy, with what we have now. But as religious and loud some Linux people are, they manage to make devs even angry so they won't consider Linux anymore.

It would be great if Epic would support Linux. For us. For those already using Linux. But I'm really afraid they won't. Please let my fear be wrong.

"But that's not Blizzard supporting Linux, it's just 1 guy helping out fellow gamers."

Yes of course but sadly many companies would forbid their employees from doing anything like that. Atleast Blizzard apparently is not one of them.

Quoting: Guesthttps://www.epicgames.com/unrealtournament/forums/unreal-tournament-discussion/ut-game-general-discussion/391382-what-s-with-the-radio-silence?p=391775#post391775

From Steve's Discord announcement:
Sorry we've gone silent for the last couple of weeks. Epic has some big releases coming out for both Fortnite and Paragon, and most members of the UT team are helping out with those games right now. We're still working on UT in a different branch, but are doing some large refactoring that is reducing build stability and doesn't make sense to merge to the main branch until it settles down. We will update you on status soon. Until then, we look forward to seeing what the community continues to create with the current build of UT, which is the most stable and best performing version we have released.

That was a year ago. Epic have since confirmed Unreal Tournament is not currently seeing active development.

Quoting: mylka

Quoting: Nevertheless

Quoting: mylka

Quoting: Guest

Quoting: mylka

Quoting: GuestThat explains the recent Valve royalty cut...

Valve is very greedy and lazy. And sadly they don't show signs of improving. They will only really try to change their ways when it is too late, as is always the case...

you say that after all they did for linux (client, steamOS, wine/proton, dxvk, mesa) for free

Well, they're doing it because it benefits them. Yes, it's of benefit to the general GNU/Linux community too, but I wouldn't quite say "free" (Valve would expect something to come of it, or they wouldn't invest). Subtle difference, but important: and no flame wars, this is a good showcase of how a company can invest in open source software for their own benefit, without trampling on user rights.

Anyway, Valve have done plenty of shady things as well. Let's not forget the paid mod fiasco. They've steadily reduced their own effort in managing their own marketplace (trying to make it community run basically means they don't have to do anything except gather the cash). That point is going to stir a few emotions I'm sure, but it's good business sense really: get others to do the work for you. I wouldn't put it quite to the extreme of greedy and lazy, but neither are Valve going to put in more effort than they have to.

Oh, and Valve do try improve because they know that if they don't, the success with Steam that they've had won't last. They've been working to give themselves a direction, a way out of stagnation. I think there's even a video of Newell saying that somewhere.

Please please please people don't read this as attacking (quite often people do). I'm not. Valve aren't golden heroes, but neither are they murky villains. They're just doing good business, and obviously GNU/Linux is, or Valve believes has the potential for, good (desktop) business.

i dont think they make the big bucks with linux
of course they wont lose money with their linux support, but if linux would be so profitable, than gog, ea, uplay, and epic already had linux support for their clients and/or their top sellers like witcher 3, battlefield, call of duty, assassins creed, fortnite, etc

so dont underestimate the effort, because the other big players just dont care about linux

Valve needs Linux, because it's bound to be open. No one can own Linux and shut it down like Windows walled gardens. So Valve invested in openness! Maybe Epic sees that now too...

i get it, but whats the point of openness, if no one uses linux? as i said. if MS makes games unplayable tomorrow, what would pc gamers do? switch to linux, mac, or buy a console?
i cant tell.

Quoting: elmapuli think an stronger valve will be better for us in the short time, then in the long time we will need competition for then.

they cant compete with microsoft in the OS right now, they need to be stronger to do that, but i dont see they geting any stronger

it is not that easy.
1) they have to make a linux client
2) they need proton, or else they wont get the linux gamers.
3) they just have 1 game as a selling point. fortnite. i dont play fortnite
4) are games cheaper, because epic just takes 12%? ubisoft games cost the same on uplay and steam. if it is not MUCH cheaper and they dont have more exclusive titles, why would i leave steam?

we are far away from competition

1 and 2, i think you didnt understand what i said, i'm not saying WE will migrate to their store, i'm saying the general gaming audience may migrate to their store and that will make valve weak, if valve gets weak we will have no one to help make us stronger.

just think about it, the reason why microsoft was able to enter in the console market is because they were near an monopoly on the desktop Operating system market, that gave then huge profits that they could use to try to enter in other markets.

the reason why google was able to enter in the mobile phones market was the google search engine wich gave then huge profits.

valve dont make as much money as microsoft, they dont have an monopoly and they will only get weaker and weaker.
you cant reduce the margin for profit in a market without being in another market to compensate and expect to have the same earnings.

3-for now they only have that.

4- are games cheaper, because epic just takes 12%? ubisoft games cost the same on uplay and steam.
yes, ubisoft had an bad time with self publishing, still they are doing it anyway, most triple A companies are doing, epic may have a chance to compete because many companies will give up leaving steam if steam change their cut, the economics of scale will not compensate the cost of self hosting

It's good, though, yet another store, yet another launcher. Valve needs strong competition, they mostly have a monopoly on bing a online retail platform for every game. The competition will do them good, and hopefully they'll have to think about their pricing for developers. The competition will do studios good.

Time will show, Steam still is king, and it's a hard business to get in because people do have their stuff at Steam. A lot of people probably are not as picky as I am (one launcher is pretty much enough for me). It's a long way to go, and Epic is not the first to try. But they've got the backing, money and Playerbase to do so (Fortnite actually has more daily players online than steam as a whole).


Last edited by STiAT on 5 December 2018 at 4:02 pm UTC

Quoting: elmapul4- are games cheaper, because epic just takes 12%? ubisoft games cost the same on uplay and steam.
yes, ubisoft had an bad time with self publishing, still they are doing it anyway, most triple A companies are doing, epic may have a chance to compete because many companies will give up leaving steam if steam change their cut, the economics of scale will not compensate the cost of self hosting

Games won't become cheaper just because market fees are lower. Digital non essential goods prices are not made taking into account fixed costs and by undercutting competition. They are sold at the highest price possible at each market. That's why prices in Russia or south America are lower and in Australia are higher. And that's why prices drop after a while: after I sold the game full price to everyone that wanted to pay that amount, I have no reason to not lower the price and sell to the people who only buys with lower prices. New copies are "produced" for free. People don't buy out of necessity so they can pass over a pricey game. But at the same time they have no alternatives (I buy apples instead of oranges) since every game is unique. Making game prices is completely different than making prices for stuff like cars or bread.

The money that developers save will be used for better and more games in case of small devs, will become revenues for larger devs.

The good about Valve was that a part of that money was redirected into innovation and openness instead of becoming pure profit.


Last edited by Mal on 5 December 2018 at 6:57 pm UTC

I don't know if I would call a shop exclusively for a single game engine from a single publisher "serious competition" for Steam. Unless Epic tries to muscle developers to only release through the Epic store (unlikely) then I suspect most folks will publish to Steam and GoG as well and collect their profits from whichever distribution system customers happen to use.