Another Steam Client Beta is out, adds the ability to force Steam Play

Quoting: Guest

Quoting: mylkadevelopers dont have to recognize linux as a platform! GAMERS HAVE!
as i said: first market share, then developers

Exactly what IBM thought back in the day, and that move was the end of Big Blue on personal computing space for good.
You seem to dismiss developers' impact on a platform... you are probably too young to remember the "developers, developers, developers" chant from Ballmer back in 2000 too. It was cringy and meme-worthy, but he was right.

Quoting: mylkawhat do you think? what would be the alternative?

As Linus himself said, probably something akin to Chromebooks and Android, but sorry I don't have the definitive answer to that question.

i still think you cant compare now and then.
the fact that we can talk over the internet changes so many factors

maybe it wasnt the time for another OS back then. very few ppl had a PC and they were happy with what they had, software was hard to get, a lack of information about new software

today everyone has internet, everyone can download linux in no time, PCs are very cheap and everybody has one or more, even mainstream talks about linux

just look at all the software for linux. even fucking MICROSOFT skype has a linux client.... not just 1..... 3!!!!! DEB, RPM and SNAP

it is just not the same

i just dont think, that linux ports will die, because some developers have passion and they want to improve themselves
just look at DOOM2016. ID software ported the game to linux for fun (who knows why it wasnt released)
and i am pretty sure a lot of indie games will still get a port even if they dont need one because of proton

after 6 years valve tries another strategy and i think it is a good one. and again: you cant compare it with something decades ago

Sadly, though, current trend is to make the client irrelevant. Sure, consumers are stubborn, but just look at how much "simple things" have changed over the last decade (60% of that time Steam has been available on our beloved platform, mind you), in terms of people preferences simply due to the "easier" and more 'convenient' offers from music streaming services, to a myriad of video streaming services with fully fledged multimillion dollar productions, to 'storage'... computing and soon gaming. The good thing, though, is that many prefer to have physical evidence, and hence some clinge to physical copies of movies, music, books and even their data, alas the great majority prefer the more convenient solutions on their flaming new thin clients.

I would LOVE for things not to be that way, but that's where the whole IT and entertainment industries are heading, gaming included, and while on the other side of the pipe Linux is the 800 pund Gorilla ruling over the server OSes, as the client is rendered meaningless, as is the host OS... I'm not sure what can we expect in the next 5 years.

Quoting: GuestIn the short run Proton is getting us more games, but in the long run it is encouraging developers to not even recognize Linux as a platform: they will keep writing software for Windows, they will still not support Linux, and they will have one less reason to even consider developing their games with a multiplatform focus from the start.

Eventually Microsoft will close their garden and will force developers to join The Windows Store: If your game or software is not there, suddenly it will not work on windows 10 or the next windows...
I don't see big publishers like EA and Ubisoft closing their respective clients for to join the Windows Store....
I don't see Indie devs joining the Windows Store.

Remember that this was the reason why Valve decided to make the Linux incursion... and it will happen, maybe after the EOL of Windows 7, in a year.

Quoting: Sil_el_motGreat! Now i can try payday2 in vr!

After trying it now for an hour i can tell you, it works great in vr now(the same as in windows).

Quoting: Thetargos

Quoting: mylka

Quoting: Thetargos

Quoting: mylkawhat do you think? what would be the alternative?

WaaS*, that's what... plus soon-ish gaming will move to the cloud, so you will only rent access, and own nothing... though that could be said is true already with digital distribution and always on-line DRM (not only digital distribution), albeit without a periodic fee. So your "client" device won't matter if it's a PC, Chromebook, phone, tablet, Switch, XBOX or PSX.

*Windows as a Service. Plus, as ironic as it sounds, there are already projects and efforts to implement past MS APIs on top of modern Windows (Wine for Windows, if you will) in order to run older software... so...

thats not an alternative. if you think streaming is the future, it makes everything else unimportant and it doesnt matter if we have native or proton or anything

That's the direction the industry is going anyway. See what are doing MS with the XBox and Google and nVidia, even.

The industry can try to go wherever it wants, but unless they're willing to step up and build the internet of tomorrow, the reality of infrastructure is gonna block games-as-a-streamed-service. Lots of streamed things work fine, but note how streamed music and video take a bit of time to get started, and sometimes pause in the middle. Would this kind of thing fly for games?
The problem is there's lots of money in things that exploit a really robust internet infrastructure (many of them hostile to the interests of consumers)--but there's pretty much no money in building that infrastructure, so nobody wants to. Which would mean government would do it, except current economic orthodoxy says governments aren't supposed to do anything constructive, they're supposed to cut taxes (on the rich). So: Until there's a big time political change in the world, the infrastructure for this stuff will come slowly. Maybe faster wireless will make a difference.


Last edited by Purple Library Guy on 19 January 2019 at 12:30 am UTC

Quoting: Comandante ÑoñardoI don't see big publishers like EA and Ubisoft closing their respective clients for to join the Windows Store....

I could imagine something like Origin itself being on WS and Microsoft taking a cut on "in-app purchases" i.e. games bought from within Origin. Not that the AAAs would like that, but what are they gonna do if Microsoft forces their hand? (Of course it would be a dangerous move to make for Microsoft since the AAAs could turn to consoles exclusively and kill PC gaming, but 1) I'm not sure Microsoft cares at this point since they have the XBOX and have been buying studios and 2) it's not unlike them to shoot themselves in the foot like that.)

Quoting: Comandante ÑoñardoI don't see Indie devs joining the Windows Store.

They will if it's the only way to get decent sales besides consoles.

Yes, there many (not only one) bottlenecks before GaaS is a thing, however, at the rate things are moving, the next 5 years seem rather blurry. I hope things stay pretty similar and the games streaming bubble bursts, alas, I cannot say. Network speed is but one piece of the puzzle, input latency is more critical, plus framerate will be an issue. So my hope is that demanding PC gamers will demand local games rather than streaming. The whole adoption for our platform lies in a conundrum. At least tangibly I've seen people flee W10, sadly, to OSX for the most part and the less for Linux, but still there is a seemingly constant stream of new users, to our overall benefit.


Last edited by Thetargos on 19 January 2019 at 1:11 am UTC

Quoting: ThetargosYes, there many (not only one) bottlenecks before GaaS is a thing, however, at the rate things are moving, the next 5 years seem rather blurry. I hope things stay pretty similar and the games streaming bubble bursts, alas, I cannot say. Network speed is but one piece of the puzzle, input latency is more critical, plus framerate will be an issue. So my hope is that demanding PC gamers will demand local games rather than streaming. The whole adoption for our platform lies in a conundrum. At least tangibly I've seen people flee W10, sadly, to OSX for the most part and the less for Linux, but still there is a seemingly constant stream of new users, to our overall benefit.

German computer magazine c't ran a test lately. People having been told they were playing at a GaaS system complained - people they didn't tell it didn't even realize it. That probably won't be true for hardcore gamers, but for the majority (as long as their internet connection is good enough) won't see or at least won't care for the difference. (I heart there's people playing at 30 fps out there...!)

Quoting: Eike

Quoting: ThetargosYes, there many (not only one) bottlenecks before GaaS is a thing, however, at the rate things are moving, the next 5 years seem rather blurry. I hope things stay pretty similar and the games streaming bubble bursts, alas, I cannot say. Network speed is but one piece of the puzzle, input latency is more critical, plus framerate will be an issue. So my hope is that demanding PC gamers will demand local games rather than streaming. The whole adoption for our platform lies in a conundrum. At least tangibly I've seen people flee W10, sadly, to OSX for the most part and the less for Linux, but still there is a seemingly constant stream of new users, to our overall benefit.

German computer magazine c't ran a test lately. People having been told they were playing at a GaaS system complained - people they didn't tell it didn't even realize it. That probably won't be true for hardcore gamers, but for the majority (as long as their internet connection is good enough) won't see or at least won't care for the difference. (I heart there's people playing at 30 fps out there...!)

Interesting, do you have a link for that?
(Or do you refer to the printed magazine?)

Quoting: jens

Quoting: EikeGerman computer magazine c't ran a test lately. People having been told they were playing at a GaaS system complained - people they didn't tell it didn't even realize it. That probably won't be true for hardcore gamers, but for the majority (as long as their internet connection is good enough) won't see or at least won't care for the difference. (I heart there's people playing at 30 fps out there...!)

Interesting, do you have a link for that?
(Or do you refer to the printed magazine?)

I just read a test in a printed magazine of late 2018 (I'm lagging myself... X) ), but here is a even better new test online:
https://www.heise.de/select/ct/2019/1/1546333965757789

For the records: Parsec was the only of the tested cloud services that had a working Linux client.