Cyberpunk 2077 confirmed for Stadia on November 19

Stadia addressed all the above already for CDPR.

Quoting: ShmerlStadia addressed all the above already for CDPR.

We don't know. And as it was previously mentioned, in order to make a proper release at the bare minimum they will have do QA with Nvidia GPUs on Linux and the proprietary vulkan/radv libraries (we are not sure if the driver used in Stadia is the same that is provided with AMDGPU-PRO or if it's using Mesa). And over that, they will have to also create the third party dependencies their game will need for the distro they decide to support and maybe replace any deps that may be proprietary for Stadia. Is far to be like creating a port from scratch, but it isn't also a straight forward operation.

Quoting: x_wingIs far to be like creating a port from scratch, but it isn't also a straight forward operation.

I'd say cost wise it's a tiny percentage of the Stadia effort itself.

Quoting: ShmerlIt's not nonsense because you need to compare resources, not just the amount of work. Small developers have less of them than big companies. So it's a bigger risk for them because of that alone. It's harder to make profit for small developers. Yet they are the ones releasing for Linux, not the huge ones who are making way more money and have more resources for it.

Besides, the work and expenses point was addressed above. They already have invested needed effort and spent the money to make it work on Stadia,

I think it's safe to say that companies like EA and Ubisoft, two big Stadia partners, will not want to help Linux. They are big supporters of Games as a service business model and big offenders of bad practice within the industry. So them giving users more choice would possibly work against their profits, instead of one platform to get all the money they would have to accommodate for Linux too. With cross platform software they can overcome those issues, but a greedy company would not want to put in work to make change.

The reason I said it's nonsense is because I don't think releasing a game like Cyberpunk for Linux, and maintaining it over time, is as easy as a indie game. If a indie and AAA game gets equal resources to port game to Linux, I can see AAA being far more difficult. And even if both games are ported, I can imagine the AAA one breaking over time because of a dependency while the simpler indie game will have higher probability of not breaking because of less software involved. I didn't mean to sound authoritarian, I just am not convinced that referring to indies releasing on Linux is entirely valid when asking why AAA games aren't. Some software used for smaller games seems to be ubiquitous, which may explain one of reasons why indies are more prevalent on Linux.

Quoting: slaapliedjeI was wondering about Exodus the other day. In the discussion forums on Steam it sounds like they're still working on it? But I mean it's been on Stadia since forever.. so if the theory is it's just a direct thing to release a game on Stadia onto Steam with Linux support... maybe that's the one that proves it's not the case?

Sadly a lot of the 'do we port to Linux' is politically based more than financially based. Like Doom (2016) literally having a Linux port made for fun, but was never published / released.

Perhaps the holdup is 4A Games using good time because they plan to release a Redux with Vulkan raytracing. Metro Last Light port wasn't a great port. or perhaps Google has a NDA exclusivity contract with developers that prohibits them from releasing their games for Linux if they want to release for Stadia. Think about it, local play is a competitor to Stadia, whether you are on Windows, Linux or a device like Switch. A "insignificant" platform like Linux can be surely swept under the rug if a big company tries to undermine it through such tactics.

I think it's former, 4A taking good time to give us a good release. Afterall, after Epic exclusivity ended they released their game on GOG too. That must be a good sign.


Last edited by Linuxwarper on 22 October 2020 at 3:23 pm UTC

Quoting: Linuxwarper

Quoting: ShmerlIt's not nonsense because you need to compare resources, not just the amount of work. Small developers have less of them than big companies. So it's a bigger risk for them because of that alone. It's harder to make profit for small developers. Yet they are the ones releasing for Linux, not the huge ones who are making way more money and have more resources for it.

Besides, the work and expenses point was addressed above. They already have invested needed effort and spent the money to make it work on Stadia,

I think it's safe to say that companies like EA and Ubisoft, two big Stadia partners, will not want to help Linux. They are big supporters of Games as a service business model and big offenders of bad practice within the industry. So them giving users more choice would possibly work against their profits, instead of one platform to get all the money they would have to accommodate for Linux too. With cross platform software they can overcome those issues, but a greedy company would not want to put in work to make change.

The reason I said it's nonsense is because I don't think releasing a game like Cyberpunk for Linux, and maintaining it over time, is as easy as a indie game. If a indie and AAA game gets equal resources to port game to Linux, I can see AAA being far more difficult. And even if both games are ported, I can imagine the AAA one breaking over time because of a dependency while the simpler indie game will have higher probability of not breaking because of less software involved. I didn't mean to sound authoritarian, I just am not convinced that referring to indies releasing on Linux is entirely valid when asking why AAA games aren't. Some software used for smaller games seems to be ubiquitous, which may explain one of reasons why indies are more prevalent on Linux.

Quoting: slaapliedjeI was wondering about Exodus the other day. In the discussion forums on Steam it sounds like they're still working on it? But I mean it's been on Stadia since forever.. so if the theory is it's just a direct thing to release a game on Stadia onto Steam with Linux support... maybe that's the one that proves it's not the case?

Sadly a lot of the 'do we port to Linux' is politically based more than financially based. Like Doom (2016) literally having a Linux port made for fun, but was never published / released.

Perhaps the holdup is 4A Games using good time because they plan to release a Redux with Vulkan raytracing. Metro Last Light port wasn't a great port. or perhaps Google has a NDA exclusivity contract with developers that prohibits them from releasing their games for Linux if they want to release for Stadia. Think about it, local play is a competitor to Stadia, whether you are on Windows, Linux or a device like Switch. A "insignificant" platform like Linux can be surely swept under the rug if a big company tries to undermine it through such tactics.

I think it's former, 4A taking good time to give us a good release. Afterall, after Epic exclusivity ended they released their game on GOG too. That must be a good sign.

Remember back in the days when the various computer platforms were around and companies still managed to release games for all of them? DOS, Amiga, Atari ST, Machintosh? They not only had a wide variety of hardware, but also of operating systems. People tended for some reason to target the minimal Atari ST spec, the upper spec on the Amiga, and DOS / Machintosh usually got CGA / EGA versions until VGA had a lot more users. But DOS devs had the huge task of trying to figure out which hardware was popular to add support for that. But they still did it, even though DOS was definitely not a gaming platform, and not friendly to it. But still a huge majority of games were made for it as that's what systems people had. Then the 3D hardware wars happened, where there were so many APIs for people to target...

It wasn't until Windows and DirectX that there was an abstraction layer for everything. We basically have SDL that is similar, but it took a long time for that to be a thing.

But now that we have it, and we have better drivers, and a free OS, you'd think people would flock to it. Nope, because we are historically a community that is against closed source, DRM, etc. And GAME developers are ALL about the DRM.

And this is the main reason I think most games don't come to Linux. That and 'well they won't even pay for their OS, why would they do anything other than pirate our game' mentality.

Quoting: slaapliedjeRemember back in the days when the various computer platforms were around and companies still managed to release games for all of them? DOS, Amiga, Atari ST, Machintosh? They not only had a wide variety of hardware, but also of operating systems. People tended for some reason to target the minimal Atari ST spec, the upper spec on the Amiga, and DOS / Machintosh usually got CGA / EGA versions until VGA had a lot more users. But DOS devs had the huge task of trying to figure out which hardware was popular to add support for that. But they still did it, even though DOS was definitely not a gaming platform, and not friendly to it. But still a huge majority of games were made for it as that's what systems people had. Then the 3D hardware wars happened, where there were so many APIs for people to target...

It wasn't until Windows and DirectX that there was an abstraction layer for everything. We basically have SDL that is similar, but it took a long time for that to be a thing.

But now that we have it, and we have better drivers, and a free OS, you'd think people would flock to it. Nope, because we are historically a community that is against closed source, DRM, etc. And GAME developers are ALL about the DRM.

And this is the main reason I think most games don't come to Linux. That and 'well they won't even pay for their OS, why would they do anything other than pirate our game' mentality.

No, I got my first PC long time after those events. When it comes down to why games don't come to Linux it's simply because of marketshare. If marketshare was significant enough games would be developed with closed source and with Denuvo implemented into them just like with Windows.

Also it doesn't help the situation that industry has become in my opinion quite corrupt. We are at a point now where microtransactions are intertwined into a game's design and developers hold presentations titled "Let's go whaling" that explains how to maximize money siphoning from gamers using predatory practices. They don't treat Windows gamers right with these predatory practices, so I'd say it would be naive for one to think that these companies, who are releasing their games on Stadia, will be nice to us with a Linux release.

As much as I believe Stadia is a double edged sword, I believe it and primarily Proton, is chance Linux has to break free of the cage Microsoft continues to put platform in with DirectX.


Last edited by Linuxwarper on 22 October 2020 at 8:29 pm UTC

Quoting: Linuxwarper

Quoting: slaapliedjeRemember back in the days when the various computer platforms were around and companies still managed to release games for all of them? DOS, Amiga, Atari ST, Machintosh? They not only had a wide variety of hardware, but also of operating systems. People tended for some reason to target the minimal Atari ST spec, the upper spec on the Amiga, and DOS / Machintosh usually got CGA / EGA versions until VGA had a lot more users. But DOS devs had the huge task of trying to figure out which hardware was popular to add support for that. But they still did it, even though DOS was definitely not a gaming platform, and not friendly to it. But still a huge majority of games were made for it as that's what systems people had. Then the 3D hardware wars happened, where there were so many APIs for people to target...

It wasn't until Windows and DirectX that there was an abstraction layer for everything. We basically have SDL that is similar, but it took a long time for that to be a thing.

But now that we have it, and we have better drivers, and a free OS, you'd think people would flock to it. Nope, because we are historically a community that is against closed source, DRM, etc. And GAME developers are ALL about the DRM.

And this is the main reason I think most games don't come to Linux. That and 'well they won't even pay for their OS, why would they do anything other than pirate our game' mentality.

No, I got my first PC long time after those events. When it comes down to why games don't come to Linux it's simply because of marketshare. If marketshare was significant enough games would be developed with closed source and with Denuvo implemented into them just like with Windows.

Also it doesn't help the situation that industry has become in my opinion quite corrupt. We are at a point now where microtransactions are intertwined into a game's design and developers hold presentations titled "Let's go whaling" that explains how to maximize money siphoning from gamers using predatory practices. They don't treat Windows gamers right with these predatory practices, so I'd say it would be naive for one to think that these companies, who are releasing their games on Stadia, will be nice to us with a Linux release.

As much as I believe Stadia is a double edged sword, I believe it and primarily Proton, is chance Linux has to break free of the cage Microsoft continues to put platform in with DirectX.

No one in their right mind that uses Linux would allow some of the rootkits that companies have been shipping with their software. The thing is that most Linux users are savvy enough to have things in place to prevent such things. That's why companies don't bother with porting it over. But at least it seems most publishers have been removing that crap after a few months of sales. Seems Conan Exiles finally did and so now it works great in Proton.

Quoting: slaapliedjeNo one in their right mind that uses Linux would allow some of the rootkits that companies have been shipping with their software. The thing is that most Linux users are savvy enough to have things in place to prevent such things. That's why companies don't bother with porting it over. But at least it seems most publishers have been removing that crap after a few months of sales. Seems Conan Exiles finally did and so now it works great in Proton.

I don't have a issue against DRM that lasts six months to a year before it's removed. The anti cheat that's in Valorant I mind though. But it doesn't matter what I think, it will certainly not help with changing gaming on Linux. If marketshare grows, everyone can decide for themselves what software they object to. As long as Linux ecosystem isn't being harmed I don't care if people want to allow crap on their systems just so they can play a game. Alot people who don't use Linux don't care about FOSS principles but yet Linux needs them as users to change gaming landscape.


Last edited by Linuxwarper on 22 October 2020 at 9:03 pm UTC

Quoting: Guest

Quoting: drjomstoo late but my 5 cents...
We should stop acknowledge Stadia's existence.
It's as much Linux gaming as some broadcasting of Playstation game on Android phone.

Would you prefer to stop acknowledging the Wine project as well then? After all, that's for running Windows software, and Windows gaming.

I wouldn't mind.
it was already covered here on gaming on Linux site, that some devs say that they think Proton is too good to make native port.

I think I have only one title in my collection of hundreds of games that is Proton. Wither 3.

Quoting: Liam DaweFor people that don't like it, I urge you to just go and block the tag in your user settings. It's here, we're covering it, deal with it. Or, be like a reasonable adult and ignore what you don't like and are clearly not interested in. This constant back and forth is tiring.

I act like reasonable adult and voice my opinion. I am not telling you how to run the site. But I am not staying silent either. Thats what adults do. They have civil discussion/disagreement.

Quoting: GuestThere might be a miscommunication here - text is hard, and I'm not going to assume English is your first language, but coming on and saying that Stadia news should be ignored and that it's not "Linux" (GNU/Linux) is actually trying to say how the site should be run.

Especially when it's already been mentioned how it is a supported method of running games on a GNU/Linux desktop (and an Android Linux device too for that matter).

If you want a discussion, then might I suggest you give supporting evidence of your position?

I suggest, I don't 'TELL' them what to do. Telling someone what to do - assumes some kind of authority, which I don't have.

My position is simple. How supporting proprietary product, of software you don't own for a second, of a behemoth company, who is likely stops Linux ports from happening(I don't remember seeing one title that came out on stadia to be out on Linux) is helping Linux?

How is it ANY better than Microsoft?
How do you even know they use Linux?(because they said so? Boy oh boy I have a bridge to sell)

Following same rationale, Hugo, was Linux compatible 20-30 years ago! :D
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugo_(game_show)

And why do you call something Linux, when the code is not even executed on your Linux machine?

All Metro games are using DXVK on Stadia in a form or another. If you download your Google data you can find dxvk caches for Metro games.

Quoting: dubigrasuAll Metro games are using DXVK on Stadia in a form or another. If you download your Google data you can find dxvk caches for Metro games.

So, I was right....


Native Linux ports... yeah, right...
And the Argentinian peso is an strong currency.

That doesn't mean they are not Linux ports, hope we don't start again with the conspiracies.
I imagine is somethings analogue with Feral's Linux ports, they have their inside tech (Indirectx, which is also using its own caches) to translate directx to vulkan, and these guys are using dxvk instead, which is why is mentioned in the actual game credits.
As long as we consider Feral ports "native" I suppose Metro ports are also "native".

(btw, Watch Dogs Legion and Sekiro were just released on Stadia)


Last edited by dubigrasu on 30 October 2020 at 2:32 pm UTC

Quoting: dubigrasuThat doesn't mean they are not Linux ports, hope we don't start again with the conspiracies.
I imagine is somethings analogue with Feral's Linux ports, they have their inside tech (Indirectx, which is also using its own caches) to translate directx to vulkan, and these guys are using dxvk instead, which is why is mentioned in the actual game credits.
As long as we consider Feral ports "native" I suppose Metro ports are also "native".

(btw, Watch Dogs Legion and Sekiro were just released on Stadia)

That sounds to me that they're basically running Proton/Wine, so you'd argue that Proton is as native as say Tomb Raider that Feral added direct Vulkan support to, vs Stadia using DXVK?

If indeed they are running it through a Wine based wrapper, that'd make sense why we STILL do not have a Native Metro Exodus!

You don't need Proton/Wine to use DXVK.

You could use dxvk without Wine, yes. But it's still wrapping, not a fully native renderer. That's why Feral ones aren't really native either.

By native renderer I mean one that doesn't need translating DX abstractions into Vulkan ones (on whatever stage, at compile time, at runtime etc.).

Well, trying to define what is native or wrapper is like opening a can of worms, that sooner or later ends in a bloodbath of arguments. I've seen epic battles on reddit about this.
I wouldn't dare to try a definition, that's why I said "native".

Yeah, in the end what does it matter, if it performs well and is supported by developers. It's actually good they are using open source tools like dxvk, instead of closed ones like Feral do.


Last edited by Shmerl on 30 October 2020 at 4:42 pm UTC

Quoting: dubigrasuWell, trying to define what is native or wrapper is like opening a can of worms, that sooner or later ends in a bloodbath of arguments. I've seen epic battles on reddit about this.
I wouldn't dare to try a definition, that's why I said "native".

Yeah exactly. That discussion is just pointless, in every software there are always layers that translate something to something until you reach the hardware. IMHO software runs native as long as it isn’t running inside a VM.

I guess for the purist people using Unreal Engine isn’t even native on Windows anymore since there is a game engine between game code and the graphics API :)