Seems the indie team at Soda Den are having some issues with their publisher Crytivo, and their fight has caused Roots of Pacha to be removed from Steam for now.
What is the game? "Be a part of a thriving Stone Age community. Join friends in this farming and life simulation game set in the early days of civilization. Discover “Ideas,” domesticate crops, befriend animals, and contribute to the growth of your village." — it's basically a Stone Age version of Stardew Valley and it was reviewing very well too.
Now though, they're going to be losing out on likely a fair few purchases, since the Steam page has been hidden due to the dispute between Soda Den and Crytivo.
Writing in a statement on Twitter and also on their Steam Forum they said:
As you may have noticed, the Roots of Pacha Steam page is temporarily offline.
We are sad to report that we have been engaged in a dispute with Crytivo over the rights to Roots of Pacha. We worked hard to amicably resolve our issue with Crytivo internally. Instead of working with us to address the issue, Crytivo went to Valve and authorized them to remove Roots of Pacha from Steam without our knowledge or consent.
While we work out our issues with Crytivo, we’ll continue developing Roots of Pacha with the same energy we’ve always put into it. We couldn’t be any more thankful for the overall reception of the game. We’re currently working on a roadmap and are excited to say it’ll be ready for you next month!
We’re cautiously optimistic that Roots of Pacha will return to Steam very soon.
On the face of it, this could look like a publisher acting poorly but things are never quite that simple. Especially since we don't know what's been said behind the scenes, and what their publishing contract actually contained. This led to Crytivo putting out their own statement where they explained that two days after release, Soda Den contacted them to "unilaterally rescind the contract we had worked under for three years, treating it as void".
Sounds real messy.
This seems like a good time to also mention Soda Den won't be doing Native Linux support, which was part of their Kickstarter campaign. Speaking to them on Twitter previously, they said:
Being a small indie team we've opted to do PC and Mac for now, and we've verified that the game runs well on Steam Deck using Proton, so we're hoping the Linux community can enjoy the game that way for the time being.
Update 15/05/23 - 19:23 UTC: after publishing this article, the developer announced a Native Linux build is in testing.
Checking it out on desktop Linux, it works out of the box with Proton 8. I was due to review it for Linux desktop and Steam Deck, since Crytivo approved a Steam key, but it seems like it's going to be best to wait a bit on that.
Even though it's removed on Steam, you can still buy it on Humble Store.
Article taken from GamingOnLinux.com.
QuoteBeing a small indie team we've opted to do PC and Mac for now, and we've verified that the game runs well on Steam Deck using Proton, so we're hoping the Linux community can enjoy the game that way for the time being.
For what it's worth, actually supporting Proton is almost equivalent to natively supporting Linux at this point, from what I'm reading. If it is anything like my experience with other commercial software, the experience will be superior to what any native support would have been.
QuoteThis seems like a good time to also mention Soda Den won't be doing Native Linux support, which was part of their Kickstarter campaign.
Edit: https://www.gamingonlinux.com/2023/05/roots-of-pacha-removed-from-steam-after-fight-with-publisher-crytivo/comment_id=243716
Last edited by rea987 on 15 May 2023 at 7:31 pm UTC
Quoting: rea987Scammers? I wouldn't say so. Kickstarter is never a guarantee remember, and only what the developers *hope* they will get to with the funding. And arguably with Proton, you still get the game. Kickstarter should really be used if you like the game idea, not specifically the Linux side of it.QuoteThis seems like a good time to also mention Soda Den won't be doing Native Linux support, which was part of their Kickstarter campaign.
Scammers, no lose here then, pass.
You can still play it on Linux, without any problems I can see.
Last edited by Liam Dawe on 15 May 2023 at 2:03 pm UTC
Quoting: Liam DaweScammers? I wouldn't say so. Kickstarter is never a guarantee remember, and only what the developers *hope* they will get to with the funding. And arguably with Proton, you still get the game. Kickstarter should really be used if you like the game idea, not specifically the Linux side of it.
You can still play it on Linux, without any problems I can see.
Why being apologetic for a company?
Kickstarter is no showcasing either as money is changing hands. Let us define it as an "investment" in simplest terms. The investor is promised predetermined gains in return of investment. Obviously an investment usually doesn't involve guaranteed returns but it does necessitate proper explanation why investee fails to provide promised gains.
I am aware that most people here goes for "nah, Proton works just fine, who cares native" approach.
Edit: It turned out they did make Linux build;
https://www.gamingonlinux.com/2023/05/roots-of-pacha-removed-from-steam-after-fight-with-publisher-crytivo/comment_id=243716
Last edited by rea987 on 16 May 2023 at 7:02 am UTC
Quoting: rea987Why being apologetic for a company?It's not, it's just giving my thoughts on it.
Quoting: rea987I am aware that most people here goes for "nah, Proton works just fine, who care native" approach. But it still pisses me of when companies take people's money by explicitly naming Linux version, then never even attempt to make a Linux build by using Proton excuse; hence being scammer.Again, I disagree on calling it a scam. The developer just changed plan on one thing listed during crowdfunding. Anyone on Linux can still play it, if they're not sticking to an overzealous attitude to pretending Proton doesn't exist.
I get there will be disappointment on it, but it's not the end of the world and anyone who paid still gets a copy of it.
Last edited by Liam Dawe on 15 May 2023 at 3:43 pm UTC
On the other hand, the publishers sound like jerks and I don't know what the hell a "publisher" is supposed to really do these days. I mean, anyone can "publish" their game on any of the major platforms, so the publisher isn't "publishing" the game. "Publicist" or "Promoter" might be a more accurate description? So like, their job is to make more people buy the game and their go-to approach to a dispute is to make it impossible for anybody to buy the game, so as far as I can tell they're just a value subtractor. And whatever claims they may make about what's going on might as well be vacuum as far as I'm concerned, because people whose job is to puff and twist the truth should just not be listened to when there's any dispute about the truth. Probably they hid some horrible gotchas in the contract which mean that the people who actually wrote the game get dick all for it and then pulled the plug when the people who actually wrote the game said "Say, shouldn't we be getting some money when the game we wrote sells?"
Quoting: Purple Library GuyOn the other hand, the publishers sound like jerks and I don't know what the hell a "publisher" is supposed to really do these days.
I don't know the situation here, and there are definitely publishers who pull lots of "dick" moves, but often the role of a "publisher" is to provide funding for development up front. So the developers have funding from the Kickstarter, plus extra funding from the publisher, to keep them running until they actually have something they can sell. That means that the publisher takes on a lot of risk (funding something which may not finish, or have lousy sales), and so they tend to contractually give themselves a large cut of the (eventual) revenue. So if the devs took the money up front, and now have sour grapes because they have something that is selling well, they may not be legally or morally in the right either.
Quoting: Liam Dawearguably with Proton, you still get the game. Kickstarter should really be used if you like the game idea, not specifically the Linux side of it.
Just speaking for myself, but I fund Kickstarter projects for the promised native Linux support. If they don't deliver on that, I consider it a failed Kickstarter, as it's not what I funded. There are tons of games already available that I can play with Proton, and if the project "runs great with Proton" I'll pick it up when it's been out for a while, and is on sale. And I have to say, there have been a number of "finished" Kickstarter projects which are "failures" to me - although some do eventually complete - Divinity: Original Sin, Moebius, etc.
Quoting: PhlebiacSo they're still not publishers, but rather than primarily publicists, they're specialized venture capitalists. Ugh. So they're probably horrible people, but they did bring something to the table.Quoting: Purple Library GuyOn the other hand, the publishers sound like jerks and I don't know what the hell a "publisher" is supposed to really do these days.
I don't know the situation here, and there are definitely publishers who pull lots of "dick" moves, but often the role of a "publisher" is to provide funding for development up front. So the developers have funding from the Kickstarter, plus extra funding from the publisher, to keep them running until they actually have something they can sell.
Quoting: Liam DaweWell, they've now put up a Native Linux build for testing.
Yes, shortly after posting of the article, I notice non-empty Linux depot with a Linux binary and Unity engine .dll libraries which is common for Linux ports of Unity engine games. I edited my comments. Thanks for the update.
Some parts of the forum post:
QuoteWe’ve added a native Linux/Steam OS build as our tests have shown it’s more stable and has better performance than running the game with Proton.
QuoteWe’ve thoroughly tested internally on Steam Deck and with some players that it runs better, or at the very least equal, to Proton, but we’d like to hear your input. We don’t have the hardware or resources to test in the various Linux distros, but we assume that the native build will have better performance for you as well.
Quoting: rea987Quoting: Liam DaweWell, they've now put up a Native Linux build for testing.
Yes, shortly after posting of the article, I notice non-empty Linux depot with a Linux binary and Unity engine .dll libraries which is common for Linux ports of Unity engine games. I edited my comments. Thanks for the update.
Some parts of the forum post:
QuoteWe’ve added a native Linux/Steam OS build as our tests have shown it’s more stable and has better performance than running the game with Proton.
QuoteWe’ve thoroughly tested internally on Steam Deck and with some players that it runs better, or at the very least equal, to Proton, but we’d like to hear your input. We don’t have the hardware or resources to test in the various Linux distros, but we assume that the native build will have better performance for you as well.
I'm gonna need to save those quotes for future use for some people..
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