MONSTER HUNTER RISE adds new DRM that breaks it on Steam Deck (UPDATED)

Quoting: LoudTechie

Quoting: such

Quoting: melkemindInevitably, the "pirates" crack the DRM, so the only people DRM ends up hurting are the paying customers.

That's not quite the case anymore with Denuvo.

A. they just switched away from Denuvo.
B. Denuvo cracks still happen, but you're right it's the strongest I know of(every version of football manager up to 2023 and Hogwards Legacy have fallen).

There's been two people/groups cracking Denuvo that I know of - one was doing football games exclusively, the other has been radio silent for a bit now. Feel free to correct me on that. Still, not many bother with Denuvo.

I'm just saying digital lead us to a reality in which not all DRM gets circumvented eventually, but that narrative is so ingrained in everyone's consciousness that it's becoming actively harmful. We've lost as consumers, a long time ago.

Quoting: such

Quoting: LoudTechie

Quoting: such

Quoting: melkemindInevitably, the "pirates" crack the DRM, so the only people DRM ends up hurting are the paying customers.

That's not quite the case anymore with Denuvo.

A. they just switched away from Denuvo.
B. Denuvo cracks still happen, but you're right it's the strongest I know of(every version of football manager up to 2023 and Hogwards Legacy have fallen).

There's been two people/groups cracking Denuvo that I know of - one was doing football games exclusively, the other has been radio silent for a bit now. Feel free to correct me on that. Still, not many bother with Denuvo.

I'm just saying digital lead us to a reality in which not all DRM gets circumvented eventually, but that narrative is so ingrained in everyone's consciousness that it's becoming actively harmful. We've lost as consumers, a long time ago.

Radio silence in her case is relative.
Produces lots of sound and only sometimes cracks, but you're right Denuvo is quite good at what it does.
Also there're some more "low tech" groups that don't attack the code itself, but some of the weaker license key schemes(Sims crack)
The thing with this harmful mindset is that it's so prevalent, because in mathematical theory it's true(all the relevant information is send to you), but math ignores the law, societal development and language.
The copyright laws combined with language barriers and the abolishing of the harsh technological restrictions on "western hostile" nations are working.
Denuvo had to send multiple people to jail, but it did work the crackers started getting cautious with it.
Also the lack of technology restrictions on "western hostile" countries means that a lot less people in legally accepting environments are interested in cracking nowadays.
Language barriers also play a role. Sometimes large drm cracking scenes based on some general bug have sprung up in nations such as China and survived for a long time without getting noticed for years.


Last edited by LoudTechie on 22 January 2024 at 4:06 pm UTC

Quoting: t3gCapcom should have gone after the streamer instead of punishing paid consumers. Just shows how old fashioned and out of touch most Japanese businesses are.

Exactly. Most companies would respond with "Oops! Sorry guys, this fella isn't associated with us." and just bar them from handling events that they sponsor (assuming that this was a Capcom-sponsored event in the first place - I don't know if it was that or a community-run one). But noooooooooo, not Capcom.

Quoting: LoudTechieIssues I can't predict, but Proton as a container is misleading.
Proton provides 0 containment on itself and is very clear about that.

They're designed to run in a layer of security called "user space" or as others call it ring 0.
It's the difference between root and everything else(on most systems).
Within this restricted space they're willing to let programs do and whatever they like.

They actively support some forms of debugger detection, file analysis, etc. specifically to support "copy protection".
There was an actual attempt for punk buster it failed, because of an issue even Windows had(Wine just had it a lot more extreme and since punk buster got fixed they already marked it as won't fix).
The reason why malware often fails is, because it wants to run in kernel space and Proton simply doesn't support kernel commands.
The only active protection it can offer is the extra protection flatpak offers compared to

Thankyou - that's very informative.

So, is it safe to assume that, if there's anything untoward about Capcom's software beyond them adding DRM by stealth, it wouldn't actually be able to do anything?

I might be getting older, but I'm not afraid to admit that there's things I don't know - I left Windows behind so long ago that I'm just used to the fact that Linux and other Unix-likes tend to be largely trouble-free, so this affecting software I'd bought is completely new to me.

Quoting: LoudTechieRadio silence in her case is relative.
Produces lots of sound and only sometimes cracks,

Haha, that's true.

Quoting: Pengling

Quoting: t3gCapcom should have gone after the streamer instead of punishing paid consumers. Just shows how old fashioned and out of touch most Japanese businesses are.

Exactly. Most companies would respond with "Oops! Sorry guys, this fella isn't associated with us." and just bar them from handling events that they sponsor (assuming that this was a Capcom-sponsored event in the first place - I don't know if it was that or a community-run one). But noooooooooo, not Capcom.

Quoting: LoudTechieIssues I can't predict, but Proton as a container is misleading.
Proton provides 0 containment on itself and is very clear about that.

They're designed to run in a layer of security called "user space" or as others call it ring 0.
It's the difference between root and everything else(on most systems).
Within this restricted space they're willing to let programs do and whatever they like.

They actively support some forms of debugger detection, file analysis, etc. specifically to support "copy protection".
There was an actual attempt for punk buster it failed, because of an issue even Windows had(Wine just had it a lot more extreme and since punk buster got fixed they already marked it as won't fix).
The reason why malware often fails is, because it wants to run in kernel space and Proton simply doesn't support kernel commands.
The only active protection it can offer is the extra protection flatpak offers compared to

Thankyou - that's very informative.

So, is it safe to assume that, if there's anything untoward about Capcom's software beyond them adding DRM by stealth, it wouldn't actually be able to do anything?

I might be getting older, but I'm not afraid to admit that there's things I don't know - I left Windows behind so long ago that I'm just used to the fact that Linux and other Unix-likes tend to be largely trouble-free, so this affecting software I'd bought is completely new to me.

It wouldn't be able to do some very specific things, but it could still if it really wanted to in theory delete, read or edit your entire personal map until your machine is restarted(meaning mostly games and the steam client, since you've a dedicated steam deck).

The best indication. Proton aims to give everything that runs on it as much abilities as a standard browser or office app.
For a game this is still a lot of permissions, but it's not really acceptable malware level.

Ransomwaring your steamdeck won't work, spying on your Steam deck is possible although somewhat limited, crypto mining is possible(although really obvious), sending a duck waggling across your screen is possible(class mate once pulled this one on another) and all long term stuff can probably be turned off permanently by rebooting the device(non-sleep mode).

Had it been actually contained(like a flatpak or snap) it would fit the strict interpretation of your definition, but as you can see in the discussion surrounding the Steam development release about their lack of support for it is that this is still largely experimental technology from a usability perspective.*

*Don't get me started on ways to improve this. Doing that to me is like triggering your bomberman lore rant.


Last edited by LoudTechie on 22 January 2024 at 4:46 pm UTC

Quoting: LoudTechieThe only active protection it can offer is the extra protection flatpak offers compared to

The end of your sentence is cut off.

Wine/Proton could also provide some filesystem protection as it serves up a virtual one. Unfortunately, both wine and proton just map the whole root filesystem as a drive so anything could potentially have a peek at everything. I wish at least proton would be more restrictive in what it maps.

Quoting: Ehvis

Quoting: LoudTechieThe only active protection it can offer is the extra protection flatpak offers compared to

The end of your sentence is cut off.

Wine/Proton could also provide some filesystem protection as it serves up a virtual one. Unfortunately, both wine and proton just map the whole root filesystem as a drive so anything could potentially have a peek at everything. I wish at least proton would be more restrictive in what it maps.

*snap(I wasn't certain snap also sandboxed, but wikipedia says snap does so)

Winehq would never do that for it makes a generic assumption of what will be running(office apps, games, doesn't matter).
Proton has it probably somewhere on the bottom of their priority list(security isn't as sexy as say performance and much harder).
One of the g.o.l aimed Proton forks might do it though.
The first version would probably break some "copy protections".


Last edited by LoudTechie on 22 January 2024 at 4:55 pm UTC

I was just about to get the DLC for Monster Hunter World, but no interest in buying it and a week later the game gets patched with this bs drm as well.

Note to myself: Don't buy Dragon's Dogma 2 (or any other title) from this marvellous company.


Last edited by tgurr on 22 January 2024 at 5:37 pm UTC

Quoting: Guest

Quoting: NeoTheFoxA reminder that Enigma is developed by a russian company, and they are trying to actively hide that fact.
Also, check this post out: https://steamcommunity.com/app/2183650/discussions/0/7091547146187298312/

What's wrong with Russian companies?

This requires cultural background.
Many of us are citizens of "the west" and have more trust in countries our own country places trust in(to your choice due to propaganda or democracy).
Normally this's no issue, but for something like drm we know it can do anything on our computer and we actively install it.
For some people this is reason to install no drm for others it's reason to be selctive.
The link he gave was supposed to further discredit the idea that using Enigma is a good idea. The indication for this was the also.
What's the specific thread feared as far as I get it, it's the fear you might not be able to sue someone once they fuck you over.
A link with the same credibility as the past one, which actually touches on the Enigma Russia issue https://steamcommunity.com/app/222480/discussions/0/6852856365577877489/.


Last edited by LoudTechie on 22 January 2024 at 7:12 pm UTC

Update - Valve have now fixed it in Proton Hotfix. To select it go into the game Properties -> Compatibility, tick the box and select Proton Hotfix. It might sometimes still crash on launch, just try again.


Last edited by Liam Dawe on 22 January 2024 at 8:51 pm UTC