We've all been there right? You paid for a game, it required an active internet connection and a couple of years later the publisher decided they're done with it and shut it down leaving you with a broken game. Annoying.
Very annoying. It repeatedly happens, mostly AAA publishers that do it and their games are often quite expensive too. One of the most recent is The Crew from Ubisoft, a game that until late December last year cost £25.99. The developers at Ubisoft Ivory Tower announced on December 14th that as of March 31st, 2024 the servers would be shut down and so it will no longer be playable for anyone. The Crew 2 is still online, and Ubisoft are about to launch The Crew Motorfest on Steam on April 18th.
So now YouTuber Ross Scott of Accursed Farms, has launched the Stop Killing Games campaign to try and better highlight the issue. As noted on the campaign website: "An increasing number of videogames are sold as goods, but designed to be completely unplayable for everyone as soon as support ends. The legality of this practice is untested worldwide, and many governments do not have clear laws regarding these actions. It is our goal to have authorities examine this behavior and hopefully end it, as it is an assault on both consumer rights and preservation of media. We are pursuing this in two ways:"
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It's definitely an interesting and often frustrating issue, especially for games that could seemingly continue to let you play offline without too much trouble. It's a complicated issue though, and the campaign might not end up going anywhere, but it's certainly going to be interesting to watch.
Unquestionably a campaign I can get behind though, because I've said for years it's a really poor situation for consumers to have your purchase suddenly stop working forever that you've not just put money into but often a ton of your time. It's a question of preservation too, the games are just — gone. I miss the days where you could just host your own server.
What are your thoughts?
Article taken from GamingOnLinux.com.
Some you may have missed, popular articles from the last month:
Quoting: EhvisIt's something I see with a lot of "smart home" stuff. I stayed away from all of it for now because it's not really necessary. But I would apply the same logic as I do with games. Can I 100% self host the system if I want to? Yes, then ok, no means I won't get it.Honestly, I don't understand what a person could possibly get out of connecting appliances to the internet...
Quoting: CatKillerFull automatic refunds for every copy when a company kills the game is much simpler, and removes most of the financial incentive for that undesirable behaviour (you've still given them an interest-free loan, after all).I like this solution - it's simple and elegant.
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Quoting: Liam DaweQuoting: PenglingMy thoughts are that when you buy, say, a kettle, that kettle is yours to keep. If someone from the company that made the kettle were to come into your house a few years after you buy it and take away the kettle that you bought and paid for, that would be illegal. It should be the same for video games. It's very simple, really.But this does happen, with all these "smart" products. See news all the time about features removed, suddenly subscriptions needed to keep certain features going and so on. It's not just gaming it happens. Sadly.
Quoting: Liam DaweQuoting: PenglingMy thoughts are that when you buy, say, a kettle, that kettle is yours to keep. If someone from the company that made the kettle were to come into your house a few years after you buy it and take away the kettle that you bought and paid for, that would be illegal. It should be the same for video games. It's very simple, really.But this does happen, with all these "smart" products. See news all the time about features removed, suddenly subscriptions needed to keep certain features going and so on. It's not just gaming it happens. Sadly.
Indeed, I have been making shopping decisions based on:
Oh it's smart, eh? Can I use all its capabilities without ever connecting to your services or creating an account?
On a different note, I see the UK petition hit it's maximum of 20 user limit, and now has to go through "approval". Sigh.
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Quoting: CatKillerLegislators getting involved in what you can and can't include in your game, and how a company runs their online infrastructure years after the fact is going to get quite messy, with companies still pushing boundaries and finding edge cases.
Full automatic refunds for every copy when a company kills the game is much simpler, and removes most of the financial incentive for that undesirable behaviour (you've still given them an interest-free loan, after all).
That sure will make any kind of games where players can't host their servers financially unsustainable. Not necessarily bad thing, though will cause major changes in the market.
I'm not sure if that kind of change is easy to push through.
Just knowing when the support ends might help like with phones. If you know that you get two years of support, you know not to buy phones that area close to end of their support period unless you know you can replace the stock OS with something with longer support.
With games things can be bit fuzzy, but at least some kind of minimum support period would be good. Especially with multiplayer and games with mandatory online component. With single player games if DRM allows, there are more workarounds.
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Quoting: CatKillerLegislators getting involved in what you can and can't include in your game, and how a company runs their online infrastructure years after the fact is going to get quite messy, with companies still pushing boundaries and finding edge cases.
I can't imagine legislators doing the right thing since they'll more like side with the game companies over consumers but I do agree with you about the messiness this will entail with their involvement.
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I haven't really had this issue mainly because I don't buy games that require an online connection or a non-steam account. Most of the games I buy have no drm, so I could always still use them if something happened to steam.
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Quoting: PenglingHonestly, I don't understand what a person could possibly get out of connecting appliances to the internet...Exactly my thoughts but it gets worse... we had a new boiler installed and only after the fact I became acutely aware of this problem. To program or alter the time clock for MY boiler in MY home I have to have an online registration with Bosch and allow the thermostat on MY wall in MY hallway to connect to Bosch's server online! Where's the furious emoji?
I have a few cheap IP cams from a few years ago that I use as security cams and record constantly to my server via RTSP. Trying to buy such cams now is near impossible as they all use an app and record to the cloud via subscription. No thanks.
Sorry for the "off topic", as regards Ross'(s?) issue, I'm all for the refund idea (Catkiller) or an outright ban on singleplayer online access required.
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Quoting: PenglingHonestly, I don't understand what a person could possibly get out of connecting appliances to the internet...
They can get hacked!
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Sorry, I see it differently. It's one thing what you think you're buying and another thing what you're paying for. In my opinion, you can never buy a game because it will always be the property of its creator. In reality you are only paying for the legitimate right to use it, with permission of its creator. You cannot resell it, nor rent it, nor make any business with that right without the permission of the creator of the game. So the creator (let's assume that the creator is the owner of the rights), at any time he chooses, can stop supporting the game.
It seems to me that if you know what you are paying for, the disappointment is less.
It seems to me that if you know what you are paying for, the disappointment is less.
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Quoting: fabertaweQuoting: PenglingHonestly, I don't understand what a person could possibly get out of connecting appliances to the internet...Exactly my thoughts but it gets worse... we had a new boiler installed and only after the fact I became acutely aware of this problem. To program or alter the time clock for MY boiler in MY home I have to have an online registration with Bosch and allow the thermostat on MY wall in MY hallway to connect to Bosch's server online! Where's the furious emoji?
I have a few cheap IP cams from a few years ago that I use as security cams and record constantly to my server via RTSP. Trying to buy such cams now is near impossible as they all use an app and record to the cloud via subscription. No thanks.
Sorry for the "off topic", as regards Ross'(s?) issue, I'm all for the refund idea (Catkiller) or an outright ban on singleplayer online access required.
I spent some time to make the new house's boiler (which uses a Hive device) to be local only. At least that uses Zigbee and you can run it locally, albeit you can't adjust the schedule, but that's fine as I would rather then manage the schedule from HomeAssistant.
But it's a pain that I even need to do that to get it to work at all.
Re cameras, I've started using RTSP cameras that allow to integrate with a 3'rd party NVR, so the more expensive corporate things. On the cheaper end of that is Reolink/Dahua and my Reolink cameras are working great. But it's a pain that everyone is pushing for cloud-first these days.
!Grumpy-emoji!
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Maybe gather money and buy some of these games instead paying licenses of closed-source games? We can release source code and assets.
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Quoting: slackSorry, I see it differently. It's one thing what you think you're buying and another thing what you're paying for. In my opinion, you can never buy a game because it will always be the property of its creator. In reality you are only paying for the legitimate right to use it, with permission of its creator. You cannot resell it, nor rent it, nor make any business with that right without the permission of the creator of the game.Are renting games (that worked at release) and reselling physical copies (that were fully playable from disk) already gone from people’s memories? The always-online model isn’t a fundamental requirement of video games. It’s a symptom of the greed and lower quality standards of today’s industry.
You don’t own the IP, but you sure should own your copy of it just like books, music and films.
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Quoting: grigi....On the cheaper end of that is Reolink/Dahua and my Reolink cameras are working great. But it's a pain that everyone is pushing for cloud-first these days.
!Grumpy-emoji!
I'll check those cams out, thanks for the heads up.
As for the theromostat, I think I'll replace it with a LAN only solution.
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Quoting: AnzaThat sure will make any kind of games where players can't host their servers financially unsustainable. Not necessarily bad thing, though will cause major changes in the market.
For a start you'd expect every planned-obsolescence game to shut down the day before the law goes into effect.
QuoteI'm not sure if that kind of change is easy to push through.
No legislation is easy to push through (broadly by design), but the alternative approaches to deter the conduct would be, I'd expect, even harder to get done. Refund of money to make a customer whole is often used and well understood; getting specific other actions out of companies is trickier, and will need a whole lot of argument. See, for example, regulation of gambling in games.
QuoteJust knowing when the support ends might help like with phones. If you know that you get two years of support, you know not to buy phones that area close to end of their support period unless you know you can replace the stock OS with something with longer support.
With games things can be bit fuzzy, but at least some kind of minimum support period would be good. Especially with multiplayer and games with mandatory online component. With single player games if DRM allows, there are more workarounds.
Purchases coming with an advertised fixed expiry date would allow the market to price accordingly, and that's the kind of thing that might allow a company to avoid refunding everyone. If, at the point of sale, codblops77 says "this product will cease to function on 30 April 2025“ then the customer is informed and can choose to purchase, or not purchase, accordingly.
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Kimyrielle Apr 3
I don't know the guy, but he's right.
It should be legally mandated for studios to remove all DRM components one year after first release of the game and, for games having online features, to release all tools needed to operate the game on a private server on the same day the studio ceases operation of the official server.
It should be legally mandated for studios to remove all DRM components one year after first release of the game and, for games having online features, to release all tools needed to operate the game on a private server on the same day the studio ceases operation of the official server.
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I remember when Amazon released Crucible. They shut the servers down on the same year of the game release.
It was a free-to-play game but with some micro transactions.
It was weird how fast they thrown everything in the trash bin.
It was a free-to-play game but with some micro transactions.
It was weird how fast they thrown everything in the trash bin.
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Well, I'm already doing my part by not making any purchase of anything from the usual suspects in the last decade, like Ubisof and EA. You only encourage them to keep doing despicable things like this, if you keep buying their games. So do not buy them, send this clear message.
Last edited by M@GOid on 3 April 2024 at 4:07 pm UTC
Last edited by M@GOid on 3 April 2024 at 4:07 pm UTC
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pentadrago Apr 3
I'm still mad at Ubisoft for the loss of my Assassin's Creed DLC's (by shutting down the servers).
On the other hand I like how Crystal Dynamics handled the end of life of (the service game) Marvel's Avengers by releasing a definitive edition containing all service content. That was my reason to buy it after avoiding it for some time as I'm no fan of service games. In an ideal world this would be the version to be sold for all eternity but somehow licenses happened or something.
I expected Ubisoft to also release a final patch removing the server connection and giving all DLC content but unfortunately they just didn't care about their own games.
On the other hand I like how Crystal Dynamics handled the end of life of (the service game) Marvel's Avengers by releasing a definitive edition containing all service content. That was my reason to buy it after avoiding it for some time as I'm no fan of service games. In an ideal world this would be the version to be sold for all eternity but somehow licenses happened or something.
I expected Ubisoft to also release a final patch removing the server connection and giving all DLC content but unfortunately they just didn't care about their own games.
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Linux_Rocks Apr 3
At least Polyphony Digital released or is releasing a patch to make Gran Turismo Sport offline play on PS4. So that's better than nothing, and another reason why I like them as developers.
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Linux_Rocks Apr 3
Quoting: PenglingHonestly, I don't understand what a person could possibly get out of connecting appliances to the internet...It's a niche thing, but my bougie friend has a smart wine chiller. It was nice having the Champagne the proper temp when we got back from hanging out before. She showed me the app, and I joked that the app looked like the app for this smart NSFW toy that you can control over the internet. Which we both found hilarious. XD
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Quoting: PenglingThis is very much reminding me of that Cory Doctorow story Unauthorized Bread, which of course isn't in any way a satirical call to action on all this stuff.Quoting: Liam DaweBut this does happen, with all these "smart" products. See news all the time about features removed, suddenly subscriptions needed to keep certain features going and so on. It's not just gaming it happens. Sadly.I honestly didn't know that - as with not buying into the sorts of games afflicted by these issues, I've never bought into those sorts of appliances either. A fridge really doesn't need to be connected to the internet, y'know?
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