China continues rising on the Steam Survey with Linux now at 1.87%

Personally I find this fascinating that China is so Windows-centric. It might be because there's no IP laws and a lot of these are pirated copies of Windows (so basically free as in beer), but still, it's an American product, I would think its use would be discouraged at the very least. I guess Red Flag Linux didn't gain as much popularity as they hoped it would. ;-)

On the other hand, Linux is an open system while Windows is fully controlled plus they might have some deal in place for backdoors and stuff, so everyone is happy (I mean the corporation and the government).


Last edited by pb on 2 October 2024 at 7:53 am UTC

Personally I find this fascinating that China is so Windows-centric. It might be because there's no IP laws and a lot of these are pirated copies of Windows (so basically free as in beer), but still, it's an American product, I would think its use would be discouraged at the very least. I guess Red Flag Linux didn't gain as much popularity as they hoped it would. ;-)

On the other hand, Linux is an open system while Windows is fully controlled plus they might have some deal in place for backdoors and stuff, so everyone is happy (I mean the corporation and the government).

Honestly, I think it is mostly because Windows has really, REALLY good support for Chinese language + Pinyin.

Linux support of those two is absolutely abysmal - yeah, you can get something installed that "kind of works", but it will still be far, far away from the support MS offers for this.

And because that is the case, there are not many Chinese Linux users, and because of that, not much effort goes into improving the situation, and there you are, vicious cycle.

I tried learning Chinese for a while and I totally get why no Chinese person would want to touch Linux, even IF they were tech affine and not afraid of terminals.


Last edited by TheSHEEEP on 2 October 2024 at 8:15 am UTC

Personally I find this fascinating that China is so Windows-centric. It might be because there's no IP laws and a lot of these are pirated copies of Windows (so basically free as in beer), but still, it's an American product, I would think its use would be discouraged at the very least. I guess Red Flag Linux didn't gain as much popularity as they hoped it would. ;-)

On the other hand, Linux is an open system while Windows is fully controlled plus they might have some deal in place for backdoors and stuff, so everyone is happy (I mean the corporation and the government).

Honestly, I think it is mostly because Windows has really, REALLY good support for Chinese language + Pinyin.

Linux support of those two is absolutely abysmal - yeah, you can get something installed that "kind of works", but it will still be far, far away from the support MS offers for this.

And because that is the case, there are not many Chinese Linux users, and because of that, not much effort goes into improving the situation, and there you are, vicious cycle.

I tried learning Chinese for a while and I totally get why no Chinese person would want to touch Linux, even IF they were tech affine and not afraid of terminals.

I used to use Deepin, which is a very good Chinese Linux desktop and distribution. I stoped because I got some hanzi, French and English mixed and that was too much for me.

But I wholeheartly agree with you, Linux community should be more welcoming to Linux users. Deepin is my favorite Gnome variant so far, it's a pity I have to stop using it.

Personally I find this fascinating that China is so Windows-centric. It might be because there's no IP laws and a lot of these are pirated copies of Windows (so basically free as in beer), but still, it's an American product, I would think its use would be discouraged at the very least. I guess Red Flag Linux didn't gain as much popularity as they hoped it would. ;-)

On the other hand, Linux is an open system while Windows is fully controlled plus they might have some deal in place for backdoors and stuff, so everyone is happy (I mean the corporation and the government).

Honestly, I think it is mostly because Windows has really, REALLY good support for Chinese language + Pinyin.

Linux support of those two is absolutely abysmal - yeah, you can get something installed that "kind of works", but it will still be far, far away from the support MS offers for this.

And because that is the case, there are not many Chinese Linux users, and because of that, not much effort goes into improving the situation, and there you are, vicious cycle.

I tried learning Chinese for a while and I totally get why no Chinese person would want to touch Linux, even IF they were tech affine and not afraid of terminals.

First: I believe you immediately.
Second: That's surprising, the CCP has put quite a lot of development in developing their own Linux distros this is exactly what I would've thought would've gotten better from that effort.(kylin and derivatives)


Last edited by LoudTechie on 2 October 2024 at 8:43 am UTC

For people with knowledge of Chinese and time leftover.
This arch page contains a good list of projects you can contribute to, to fix your specific problems.
This project started as a Mandarin specific localization effort, but is more generic now.

If you would rather fix localization problems with money:
The outreachy project of SFC attempts to fix under representation issues and with that localization issues.

If you would rather fix localization problems as a job:
https://www.credly.com/org/the-linux-foundation/badge/linux-foundation-research-localization-partner-2023

Localizationlab specialises in fixing locale issues for floss



Development of good locales is difficult in open source development, because although the contributors tend to stay once they've made significant contributions.
The best way to attract them is through socials and that works a lot less with people that come from a different culture and speak a different language.

There's a reason all the medium to large projects beg for translators.

Personally I find this fascinating that China is so Windows-centric.

Not for long. In the next 1-2 years, the Chinese will significantly completely abandon Windows (even pirated versions will be cut) and switch to HarmonyOS.

They write that its microkernel is 3 times more efficient than Linux. Other sources also say that it will be possible to launch Steam + native streaming of games on DX12.2

Chinese government-sponsored developer (e.g. a company) would be completely capable of bringing proper Chinese language support to Linux. And people would switch to it, if mandated by the government. I am guessing independence from Windows is simply not something considered to be an issue by the CCP. Especially when they can force Microsoft to comply with Chinese regulations, and do all the work for them.

[edit: removed my personal experience, which is not relevant]


Last edited by Linas on 2 October 2024 at 8:01 pm UTC

CCP

CPC

I'm surprised the Steam Flatpak is that high. I see more than a few people around the Web explicitly not recommend using the Steam Flatpak. Even I quit using it a while back during that AppArmor bug in Ubuntu that made certain Flatpaks, such as Steam, unusable for a time.


Last edited by CyborgZeta on 2 October 2024 at 12:54 pm UTC

Personally I find this fascinating that China is so Windows-centric.

Not for long. In the next 1-2 years, the Chinese will significantly completely abandon Windows (even pirated versions will be cut) and switch to HarmonyOS.

They write that its microkernel is 3 times more efficient than Linux. Other sources also say that it will be possible to launch Steam + native streaming of games on DX12.2

Even if the HarmonyOS switch becomes a thing, many of them will still use Windows because it has the software they need to use for their gaming, productivity and anything else that Linux doesn't have for them. Also, Windows 10 and 11 keys are cheap enough to activate it if you go to the keyshops to buy it.

CCP

CPC

Pretty sure it's CCP for Chinese Communist Party in English (in French that would be PCC).

I'm surprised the Steam Flatpak is that high. I see more than a few people around the Web explicitly not recommend using the Steam Flatpak. Even I quit using it a while back during that AppArmor bug in Ubuntu that made certain Flatpaks, such as Steam, unusable for a time.

Well, it works very well for me, avoids cluttering my home with random game files, I don't require multilib on my system, and it sandboxes proprietary applications (games are not known for their good security practices). I've been using it for years, and only had the occasional issue (such as CEF sandboxing initially not working in Gmod).

Why are there so many Chinese users on Steam? I thought they have their own version created for the Chinese market?

Why are there so many Chinese users on Steam? I thought they have their own version created for the Chinese market?

That's true afaik, but A) They might work around that "restriction" and B) who knows if both versions don't count into the same statistic.

Pretty sure it's CCP for Chinese Communist Party in English

Of course not

Spoiler, click me

Correct writing - Communist Party of China. There is even an official website.
This is how you should write in official and business correspondence.

The writing CCP is used to stigmatize the name of the Communist Party (for example, how is Sheena offensive instead of China). CPC - "Communist Party of China", I mean, there is China and she is a communist party in it.

CCP - a distorted version, the "Chinese Communist Party", is used in the West to promote the discourse "there are many communist parties, the Chinese have a separate one", the obvious consequence of which is the decoupling of the structure from the state with the name China. She is not China, she is the Chinese. Some subset of the Chinese. Without a country, different Chinese are just running around the globe, and sometimes they organize something there. I'm already silent about the fact that the abbreviation CCP is very similar to the СССР (USSR), although it is not written in Cyrillic. Do you understand the reference to the terrible communists?

They also like to distort the spelling and pronunciation - SeeSeePee. You can search the search networks and make sure which contingent uses it.

Pretty sure it's CCP for Chinese Communist Party in English

Of course not

I'm sorry, I really don't see what distinction are you trying to make here. I was simply referring to the ruling party in China. You know, the one and only.

Personally I find this fascinating that China is so Windows-centric. It might be because there's no IP laws and a lot of these are pirated copies of Windows (so basically free as in beer), but still, it's an American product, I would think its use would be discouraged at the very least. I guess Red Flag Linux didn't gain as much popularity as they hoped it would. ;-)

On the other hand, Linux is an open system while Windows is fully controlled plus they might have some deal in place for backdoors and stuff, so everyone is happy (I mean the corporation and the government).

When I visited a few factories there the major factor was support for certain applications, usually CAD and graphics.

Linux has only two decent commercial CAD apps: BricsCAD, and ARES Commander. Both of which are stuck using xorg crap. There is also Varicad but the interface for that is dogshit to put it mildly - think of a late 90's windows app with icon buttons EVERYWHERE. And yeah there is web based CAD now but many really do not want their stuff stored on servers externally.

Everyone seems to know the story with graphics stuff.

When I visited a few factories there the major factor was support for certain applications, usually CAD and graphics.

I'm sorry, I didn't know most of the gaming in China happened at factories. ;-)
Of course specialised software support is a major pain point for Linux, but we're talking about steam survey here, at least I was. :-)

Not for long. In the next 1-2 years, the Chinese will significantly completely abandon Windows (even pirated versions will be cut) and switch to HarmonyOS.

They write that its microkernel is 3 times more efficient than Linux.

If China claimed that in the next 5 years they will land on the sun would you believe it? Talk is cheap.

Pretty sure it's CCP for Chinese Communist Party in English

Of course not

Notice how he used the words "In English". You can call it whatever you want. In any case it's the same entity it's been for the last century and changing the name is an act of censorship to expunge the events of the last 100 years from history.

But hey, we saw Chinese SARS/Influenza changed to "The Spanish Flu" in the early 1900s and Wuhan Penumonia in the 2020s quietly changed to COVID and we certainly made sure that after Greek Alphabet Alpha, Beta, Delta, Gama variants that we didn't have a Xi (She) variant even though Ebola is named after a river, and Lymes are named after a geographical location as well. I guess naming convention rules don't apply and English can be subjected to walk on eggshells of people who don't even speak it.

If you want to refer to North Korea in English as the proper name "Democratic People's Republic of Korea" -- go ahead.

Cuba refers to itself as a "People's Democracy" https://wikiless.org/wiki/Politics_of_Cuba?lang=en#Legislature

You can call things Democracies and Republics if you want.

Many of us will not participate.

Pretty sure it's CCP for Chinese Communist Party in English

Of course not

I'm sorry, I really don't see what distinction are you trying to make here. I was simply referring to the ruling party in China. You know, the one and only.

Whats the distinction between "America" and "AmeriKKKa"? Its the same here.

Also there are about 25 parties in China

Not for long. In the next 1-2 years, the Chinese will significantly completely abandon Windows (even pirated versions will be cut) and switch to HarmonyOS.

They write that its microkernel is 3 times more efficient than Linux.

If China claimed that in the next 5 years they will land on the sun would you believe it? Talk is cheap.

Pretty sure it's CCP for Chinese Communist Party in English

Of course not

Notice how he used the words "In English". You can call it whatever you want. In any case it's the same entity it's been for the last century and changing the name is an act of censorship to expunge the events of the last 100 years from history.

But hey, we saw Chinese SARS/Influenza changed to "The Spanish Flu" in the early 1900s and Wuhan Penumonia in the 2020s quietly changed to COVID and we certainly made sure that after Greek Alphabet Alpha, Beta, Delta, Gama variants that we didn't have a Xi (She) variant even though Ebola is named after a river, and Lymes are named after a geographical location as well. I guess naming convention rules don't apply and English can be subjected to walk on eggshells of people who don't even speak it.

If you want to refer to North Korea in English as the proper name "Democratic People's Republic of Korea" -- go ahead.

Cuba refers to itself as a "People's Democracy" https://wikiless.org/wiki/Politics_of_Cuba?lang=en#Legislature

You can call things Democracies and Republics if you want.

Many of us will not participate.

If you are referring to something, try to make an effort to refer to it by the proper name. The proper English name is "CPC".

Also, DPRK is actually quite democratic with representation of all social levels in the National Assembly. Just because you see propaganda about "how bad it is", doesnt make it true

As for Linux support - its mandated in government organizations and government companies, just like in Russia. But unlike Russia, many of the government companies run on Chinas homegrown processors.


Last edited by Cato-the-younger on 2 October 2024 at 9:26 pm UTC