Valve may be working on a new kind of Steam Machine

If this supports VR... this will be the ultimate budget PC VR. :)

I don't see how this makes any sense...

A Steam Deck 2, but plugged in? It looks like it's a PC with a new AMD APU. What does that have to do with the Steam Deck being released in Australia?

Basically, assuming this Steam Machine 2 has nothing to do with VR, its better performance would essentially make the Steam Deck redundant, which would be a shame since it just released in Australia.

I seem to remember when the original Xbox came into the console market, people were saying similar things to what I've heard now: hardly anyone is gonna want a PC in a box that plugs into your TV... Yet here we are.

I stopped buying consoles (except the Switch, for my son) once Valve started supporting Linux. I don't have any interest in getting a new Sony or Microsoft system, but I would be very interested in a Valve one, for the right price and specs. And I've been using a PC hooked up to my TV as a game console ever since Big Picture Mode came out.

More than anything, I am mostly interested in the controller, though. I have one of the first Steam Controllers, and it was good, but the Steam Deck's design is more comprehensive. At the very least, I'll get one, and if it's good, I'll replace all my DualShock 4s with them. And possibly the Steam console, too.

I don't see how this makes any sense...

A Steam Deck 2, but plugged in? It looks like it's a PC with a new AMD APU. What does that have to do with the Steam Deck being released in Australia?

Basically, assuming this Steam Machine 2 has nothing to do with VR, its better performance would essentially make the Steam Deck redundant, which would be a shame since it just released in Australia.

Don't forget - you could always remote play on the Deck to whatever this new box is, too. Would probably even save a ton of battery life! 😉

I don't see how this makes any sense...

A Steam Deck 2, but plugged in? It looks like it's a PC with a new AMD APU. What does that have to do with the Steam Deck being released in Australia?

Basically, assuming this Steam Machine 2 has nothing to do with VR, its better performance would essentially make the Steam Deck redundant, which would be a shame since it just released in Australia.

Why would it make a Steam Deck redundant?! It wouldn't. It would be a powerful stationary device. The point of a Steam Deck is having a mobile device.

There wouldn't be much demand for it with exclusives, either, and neither Valve nor Steam customers like exclusives.

i know a lot of people hate the pratice of making exclusive games, but hating something dont change the facts, and the facts are: exclusive games sell hardware.

im not saying i support this pratice or we should support.

the issue is not that exclusives dont sell, the issue is that valve isnt in the market of making games, they barely make anything and when then do its all in the same genres of moba or shooters.

if they were more like nintendo having an famous franchise in each genre or made exclusivity deals like that, they would sell a lot.

The market would be "people that want an HTPC but don't want to set up an HTPC." That's pretty small - HTPCs are pretty easy to set up.

the issue is that you are seeing this as "the market of htpc" not, the market of gaming devices for the living room.
how do you explain that playstation 4 sold hundreds of millions? not to mention, steamdeck have much more games than nintendo switch, and AAA games while switch barely have any AAA beside nintendo own games, but switch sell in a month what the deck sell in a year, how do you explain that?

you are saying that the market of HTPC is small , but you ignore WHY its small, if the price was the only reason then switch shouldnt be outselling the steam deck that much.

What makes it a success compared to creating your own HTPC:
1. Standardized hardware, meaning, game creators can create custom profiles like they do for the steam deck.
2. You don't have to build it yourself
3. Probably competitive pricing
4. Perfect support for things like CEC and bluetooth wake up. Turning on the steam controller turns on the console and the TV.

5. it need to be a silent device as well

The point of a Steam Deck is having a mobile device.

Fair point.

Things have changed dramatically since the original failure of the Steam Machine launch [...]

[...] since the steam machines floped [...]

I'm not complaining, 10 years ago Valve laid the foundation for technologies which have had millions of sales and increased the Linux gaming catalog by ten thousand plus. An itteration of the SteamOS software platfom is also part of the current success of Steam Deck and future devices.

For for sensationalism, and engagement purposes the sky is always falling ;D And maybe for a cool comeback story?

[...] jokes aside im not sure there is demand for it without exclusives [...]

I postulate that exclusives are not necessary as long as the Mainline Device outperforms other options. Case & Point -- Half-Life Alyx + Valve Index.

If the experience on other devices is sub-optimal -- then optimal experience will drive sales even without exclusivity. This was the case when iPad & iTunes experience on Windows was slow, crashie, and bad in the early 2000s which led to the sale of iMacs for people who wanted a better iTunes and therefore iPod experience.

The Valve Index experience is just better -- Valve Steam Deck is just better.

Historically too it was part Alienware's fault -- apparantly they had a decent amount of hardware problems which Valve got the bad flack for when really it was just Dell not having their devices completely baked yet.

The market would be "people that want an HTPC but don't want to set up an HTPC." That's pretty small

I wouldn't underestimate the market -- for example PlayStation 2 and Xbox were both purchased in hundreds of millions of units primarily because it was also a DVD player -- later PlayStation 3 was similarly purchased to double as a BluRay player.

Additionally, a lot of people when they use a Living Room game console ask for things like "Web Browser", "Netflix", etc... as seen in the advent of Smart TV drawing sales.

It could make the primary interface Steam rather than Kodi for some folks, though, especially if they can integrate some Kodi-style functions into Steam.

My experience with Kodi has been abysmal. I still can't really find a optimal remote that does all the functions without a hundred extra buttons. (Are you listening Valve? Maybe make a Valve Remote please?)

The amount of time required to research addons and configure Kodi is too much of a entry barrier. I would rather save my time and throw money at something to save me my time. I would even buy Kodi Plus or something if it meant a system that went toe to toe with SmartTV functions without the nonsense in a FOSSy way. It's totally okay to sell FOSS @Kodi. (Eg: Redhat, Ubuntu, Linux Autos, etc..)

They've learned some useful lessons from the Steam Machines, of course. They've got their own hardware expertise and pipeline now, so they aren't reliant on OEMs [...] They've got Proton now, so they've got 80-90% of the Steam catalogue working without relying on game devs, rather than the ~40% that game devs managed last time.

Excellent points. Having those manufacturing industry channels and professional resources really has paved the way for Steam Deck, and for future achivements. Which is why this is a really exciting prospect even if it is just speculation at this point.

I don't expect it to be a big seller. Even with Valve managing to keep the price low with Steam revenue and modest economies of scale.

From the Valve interviews I recall that they were very modest and Steam Deck sales exceeded their expectations quite a lot.

I think they will approach the market with this same modesty and probing it will reveal at least millions of sales if the price is able to be competitive.

Valve proved they can create a console like experience on handhelds.
They can do it for sure now on stationary consoles too.

[...] there's the rumor about the new Steam Controller. That fits perfectly into the picture. [...]

Edit:
What makes it a success compared to creating your own HTPC:

Yes.

1. Standardized hardware, meaning, game creators can create custom profiles like they do for the steam deck.

Exactly. Having hardware helps developers zero and provide a consistent experience. Computers are thousands of times more powerful than 20 years ago, standardization really helps developers and customers.

2. You don't have to build it yourself

Enthusiasts may underestimate the value of this. Building a few servers or desktops can be fun as an enthusiast, but as a job after a few dozen it gets tiring and the hours required to prepare, oranize, build, troubleshoot all these machines is multiplied the more devices you own -- there is a serious advantage of just being able to offload that work, and making sure everything is compatible -- for a lot of people it is well worth a small cost difference, plus a standard warranty. Again, excellent points.

3. Probably competitive pricing

I know Gabe Newell called Steam Deck competitive pricing "painful" but if they could make a Steam Machine v3 (I'm skipping 2 as SteamOS is v3) -- have competitive pricing, it could really multiply uptake as it has in the case of Steam Deck. I am hopeful the base model costs about 499.

4. Perfect support for things like CEC and bluetooth wake up. Turning on the steam controller turns on the console and the TV.

It's possible to achieve those things with building a HTPC yourself, but it's way harder to get it to the comfort level of like a Playstation. Things like CEC usually don't even work on normal AMD and Nvidia GPUs.

To go along with that point -- I would like to see new Valve Consoles double as a Wireless Access Point -- this will alow Steam Deck players to link up to the Console for multiplayer games in situations where a person doesn't have a wireless router, the technology could be extended to Steam Decks interlinking without a wifi router as well when mobile.

If this supports VR... this will be the ultimate budget PC VR. :)

Very true. That could increase the value of the device significantly for a "Plug & Play" VR experience without wires.

Don't forget - you could always remote play on the Deck to whatever this new box is, too. Would probably even save a ton of battery life! 😉

I do this regularly with CyberPunk 2077 -- 7900 in the Workstation does a great job at crunching the graphics and serving to the Steam Deck.

Also, Steam Deck isn't going anyware, it's an amazing controller to play games well worth using just sitting in front of a Gaming PC or a Gaming TV. (Maybe the Steam Deck touch screen should be the Kodi Remote I have been seeking)

The market would be "people that want an HTPC but don't want to set up an HTPC." That's pretty small - HTPCs are pretty easy to set up.

the issue is that you are seeing this as "the market of htpc" not, the market of gaming devices for the living room.
how do you explain that playstation 4 sold hundreds of millions?

Exactly. Marketing is like that -- "The Cloud", "AI" pulls billions of dollars of investment money. "HTPC" as a buzz-marketing-word is no longer being worked in the same way you don't hear "Palm Pilot" or those mini windows handeld things.

not to mention, steamdeck have much more games than nintendo switch, and AAA games while switch barely have any AAA beside nintendo own games, but switch sell in a month what the deck sell in a year

Another good point -- I personally want to bring my purchases and content with me. This is a valuable feature, and Nintendo games although attuned to the hardware well have visibly inferior graphic that are slightly annoying.

Somewhere in their Japan HQ they lost the spark and might as well be IBM now, cold, soulless, not gamers, just businessmen tonedeaf and astranged from their customers and products in some bureaucratic five-eyes hell. (Eg: the Pokemon Go Scandal)

It's no wonder Xbox has had no trouble for a while eating their lunch -- not that I follow the console wars closely anymore -- PC is just better.

If it is a new Steam Console, With careful planning, and skilled work, I have no doubt Valve will hit another homerun seeing what they've done with Steam Deck.

I think they'd work now, seeing all the improvements made to Linux gaming since the first time around. And, of course, the Deck.


Last edited by pilk on 8 Dec 2024 at 12:31 am UTC

I think it goes without saying that if Valve intends to capture a not insignificant portion of PC players (desktop or otherwise) to their SteamOS, their best chance ever will be around October next year when Windows 10 security updates stop.

Why would that change anything? It'd be no different to when Windows XP reached end-of-life, or Windows 7, or Windows 8... People will just move over to Windows 11 or whatever they're up to now, just like the gullible sheep they are.

Multiplayer games will lower sales

Valve really need to address this... Most (all?) of the "anti-cheat" systems natively support Linux-based operating systems - but almost all of the developers behind them flat-out refuse to implement their own "anti-cheat" systems for gaming under Linux.

And that means that some of the biggest games currently available don't work under Linux-based operating systems in part or at all.

Valve Software have done some fantastic stuff with SteamOS and the Steam Deck, but it's high time they start looking for way to convince developers to actually use their "anti-cheat" systems under Linux-based operating systems... And this will be a pretty big requirement if Valve ever want a new-generation Steam Machine to compete directly with "The Big Three" console manufacturers.

I fear the console marked could be a much tougher front than the handheld marked was as the Steam Deck launched.

If Valve launched a new-generation Steam Machine "as is", absolutely... But if they found a way to convince developers to actually use their "anti-cheat" systems under Linux-based operating systems, that'd be one hell of a competitor, even if one technically does not own any of their games.

5. it need to be a silent device as well

That's not hard - my laptop and my PlayStation 5 make very little noise when working under a load... As long as you have great ventilation in both the console and the environment, it's not a problem.

---

Anyway, I hope there's some substance to this, because after the current generation of consoles, which has been unbelievably disappointing, I honestly don't think I'm going to bother with a PlayStation 6"... And I've had them all to date, along with most Segas and Nintendos.

With a new generation of a Steam Deck, I'd lose the ability to "own" my games - but overnight, my potential console library would be in the low thousands at worst, under a cutting-edge, Linux-based operating system that is always evolving.


Last edited by Cyba.Cowboy on 8 Dec 2024 at 1:36 am UTC

Why would that change anything? It'd be no different to when Windows XP reached end-of-life, or Windows 7, or Windows 8... People will just move over to Windows 11 or whatever they're up to now, just like the gullible sheep they are.

Because it is in fact different this time. Windows 11 is complete garbage, even the gullible sheep realise this themselves this time, really, I have friends who always talk shit for being "eccentric and weird" (all for me not bending to the destructive social norms of our generation, long story, not the right place LOL), and they're asking me about Linux now, because they refuse to jump to 11 and are seeing the writing on the wall. Sure, it won't be everybody, or even the majority, but like I said, it'd be a noticable percentage, if Valve plays it well, and Microsoft keeps this downward spiral of theirs going.

Another thing is Linux frankly wasn't up for it during the examples you gave (Windows 8 etc), but now it is. I only switched after dabbling a little in March this year.

The amount of time required to research addons and configure Kodi is too much of a entry barrier. I would rather save my time and throw money at something to save me my time. I would even buy Kodi Plus or something if it meant a system that went toe to toe with SmartTV functions without the nonsense in a FOSSy way. It's totally okay to sell FOSS @Kodi. (Eg: Redhat, Ubuntu, Linux Autos, etc..)

Since I found Plex and now Jellyfin, I have no use for Kodi anymore. My experience is the same as yours, a lot of configuration and plugins and the controls are bit hard.

The amount of time required to research addons and configure Kodi is too much of a entry barrier. I would rather save my time and throw money at something to save me my time. I would even buy Kodi Plus or something if it meant a system that went toe to toe with SmartTV functions without the nonsense in a FOSSy way. It's totally okay to sell FOSS @Kodi. (Eg: Redhat, Ubuntu, Linux Autos, etc..)

Since I found Plex and now Jellyfin, I have no use for Kodi anymore. My experience is the same as yours, a lot of configuration and plugins and the controls are bit hard.

I have to agree. I like Kodi, but Jellyfin has been a breeze in comparison. The WebOS client on my LG OLED can be a bit fussy with some file formats, but otherwise it just works.

Valve has proved to a mass market that their idea works with the SteamDeck.

Consumers should be a lot less sceptical about what a Steam Console without windows is capable of, Proton has now proven itself capable and has been accepted as such for anything outside the anti-cheat MMO’s.

Now if they can only get the pricing right, as they did on the SteamDeck then we have a gaming computer that can play the majority of PC games, and is priced competitively with building your own PC. Also functions well as a console. Whole different story to the first Steam Machines.

I would say it will only work if Valve are producing the hardware themselves but would love to be proved wrong.

My prediction: Valve has excess mainboards and are thinking along the lines of how people re-use Framework mainboards and throw them in little 3d printed cases as set tops.
Valve will have a cute little housing to place the mainboard and fan, maybe they can tweak performance up slightly too? But they'll be selling either new or refurbished mainboards as PCs that live under your TV.

See, there's a lot of conflicting reports on what this 'Steam Machine' could be. Either it's essentially a Steam Deck 2 but plugged in, or it's a VR box that streams wirelessly to a headset.

Both are concerning.

Steam Deck 2 releasing now would be weird, since Steam Deck 1 just got released in Australia, and it has only been 2 years since its release everywhere else.

VR on Linux isn't great either. I would be confident in this approach if I saw any upstream changes in that field, but there hasn't been any so far, and with Steam Link for Quest headsets only working on Windows, there's a high chance that any future headsets from Valve will only work with Windows first and that Linux will be an afterthought.

I'm still cautiously optimistic. I know they are working on something, but I'm going to do my usual strategy of waiting a year before buying.

To be fair, Valve developed a lot of what made the SteamDeck so great in secret, too. Pretty much all of that work is now in the open and can be used by all of us. There is a chance they have secret SteamVR/Proton/SteamLink branches available. Taking all rumors into consideration, it's not unreasonable they will create a whole ecosystem to rival consoles and push VR. Deckard as a standalone equivalent to Quest/Pico, Foremont as a couch appliance and potential streaming backbone for SteamDeck and Deckard. Sure, if you have a powerful PC, Foremont may be not for you, but after the last years of crypto/AI craziness, more people then ever run crappy old machines. Xbox has lost relevance, PS5 Pro is a flop, PSVR2 was killed. This might be the best opportunity ever to bridge PC and console gaming.

SteamOS public release until then is definitely possible.

If this would be true i might ditch my Pop! OS from my system. I use Pop! OS since the end of 2021

SteamOS public release until then is definitely possible.

If this would be true i might ditch my Pop! OS from my system. I use Pop! OS since the end of 2021

There wouldn't really be anything special about SteamOS if you're already on Linux, you should be able to do everything SteamOS can do in your distro as is.

A public release of SteamOS would be (at least for me) a signal that gaming on Linux is finally at full parity in all kinds of setups and for all kinds of players, as I think Valve wouldn't release SteamOS until the low-hanging fruit are dealt with (perfecting HDR, Nvidia drivers, anticheats...)

SteamOS public release until then is definitely possible.

If this would be true i might ditch my Pop! OS from my system. I use Pop! OS since the end of 2021

There wouldn't really be anything special about SteamOS if you're already on Linux, you should be able to do everything SteamOS can do in your distro as is.

A public release of SteamOS would be (at least for me) a signal that gaming on Linux is finally at full parity in all kinds of setups and for all kinds of players, as I think Valve wouldn't release SteamOS until the low-hanging fruit are dealt with (perfecting HDR, Nvidia drivers, anticheats...)

Nah, when SteamOS is going public, it just means Valve took some time to make decisions about legal issues, branding, integrate an installer and replace all shortcuts that assumed it will run on specific hardware. SteamOS is what it is - a specialized distro, designed to be gaming first, fully usable without mouse/keyboard, stable, easy to maintain. It's really good at that, but so are many open source clones like bazzite.
Foremeont on the other hand would be a clear signal thinks SteamOS can stand up against Playstation and Xbox, which is awesome. That doesn't mean it must break through the market and suddenly beat Sony in sales. Every person that experienced an open platform might think twice about investing in walled gardens in the future, which essentially is a win for Valve and all of us.
I'd still be glad when it's finally released and agree with you that Linux is great for gaming with the exception of VR and obviously anticheat bs. I'm really hopeful foremont and deckard mean Valve have something up their sleeves on the VR compatibility front.
Anticheat BS might solve itself when behavior based AI solutions roll out or anyone builds an equivalent to the userspace observer Microsoft announced and hopefully our market share grows further.


Last edited by const on 9 Dec 2024 at 11:23 am UTC