Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: Kimyrielle

Quoting: Purple Library GuyAs a side note, consider natural gas. Russia has few pipelines through which to sell natural gas. The main one westward runs through Ukraine. So, the United States staged a coup in Ukraine, then mounted a sustained and increasingly massive pressure campaign to block the building and use of a new pipeline (Nordstream 2) that didn't run through any NATO countries, specifically and explicitly on the basis that the sale of Russian gas should be blocked because it's Russian. What was Russia supposed to think about this? That it's normal commerce? Of course it's an attempt at economic strangulation.

US policy was more geared towards Europe not buying -any- gas from Russia, no matter what pipeline it arrives through.

Uh, yes, that was kind of my point. As I say, what was Russia to make of this stance?

Quoting: KimyrielleTurns out it was the correct stance to have. You can't make yourself dependent on an unfriendly, aggressive nation.

Sure. At what point did the US start trying to cut off Russian trade in gas, and at what point did Russia start being unfriendly?

I would say that US/Russia relations always were of a competitive nature, maybe aside from the few years when Yeltzin was in power. Other than that, they have been trying to harm each other's interests for the better part of the past 100 years. I still fail to understand what point you're trying to make. Are you trying to say that unfriendly US trade actions are acceptable justification for Russia to invade a neighboring nation without any provocation and reduce it to rubble? From all I know, Ukraine did absolutely -nothing- to threaten Russia, except trying to join a defensive military alliance Russia's leadership doesn't like, because it's standing for values it despises, namely democracy and freedom. Even after the expansion, NATO never did anything worth mentioning to threaten Russia. No nukes in the new member states. No large troop deployments anywhere near them. When there were exercises in the region, Russia was typically invited to observe them. What of that constitutes a threat to them?

This "we were so mean to Russia" thing is just rubbish, IMHO. Russia in general and Putin in particular were salty about losing their Soviet Empire and they want it back, so they can be a big shiny world power again. Ukraine wanted to join the West instead. Russia sent the missiles and the tanks to prevent that from happening. It's about territorial expansion. That's really all there is to the story. No all things in life are super complicated...

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Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: Kimyrielle

Quoting: Purple Library GuyRussia is there because they fear NATO encircling and strangling them. They fear NATO encircling and strangling them because that is something NATO seems to be doing and it has been often stated as a goal by US and NATO leaders.

Load a world map into your paint application of choice. Paint all NATO nations (including Finland and Sweden if you want) blue and Russia red. And then tell me what part of this looks like "encirclement"... *rolls eyes*

Mmm . . . Paint all NATO nations today blue, and paint all NATO nations in 1991 blue, and tell me what the contrast looks like.

Sure, they now have more direct neighbors states that are NATO members, when back then it was only a small stretch of shared border with Norway (and another small stretch with Turkey if you count the Soviet Union). That doesn't equal "encirclement" by any stretch of imagination. My point was, by far the largest portion of Russia's borders is NOT shared with NATO members.
The problem with Russia is that it thinks it has a natural right to have a buffer of slave states in between them and the closest country they don't like. Like it used to enslave all of Eastern Europe with puppet regimes after WW2, to create a buffer in between them and the West. Thing is that no nation gets to pick its neighbors or who they're allied with. That's just not their business, and in particular it doesn't give them any right to invade them and reducing their cities to ash. There is no such thing as a "legitimate sphere of influence". A nation's legitimate interests end at its borders and what happens an inch behind that, is none of their business.

QuoteAs a side note, consider natural gas. Russia has few pipelines through which to sell natural gas. The main one westward runs through Ukraine. So, the United States staged a coup in Ukraine, then mounted a sustained and increasingly massive pressure campaign to block the building and use of a new pipeline (Nordstream 2) that didn't run through any NATO countries, specifically and explicitly on the basis that the sale of Russian gas should be blocked because it's Russian. What was Russia supposed to think about this? That it's normal commerce? Of course it's an attempt at economic strangulation.

US policy was more geared towards Europe not buying -any- gas from Russia, no matter what pipeline it arrives through. Turns out it was the correct stance to have. You can't make yourself dependent on an unfriendly, aggressive nation. That's the #1 lesson for the West so far.

PS: I don't buy that we "staged" the Maidan revolution, at least not in a way anyone can make a reasonable claim it wouldn't have happened without us facilitating it. There is no conclusive evidence out there that anyone but the citizens of Ukraine started it. We certainly didn't -mind- it happening and I know we got somewhat involved -after- it started. That's more or less fair game. We're allowed to -welcome- a regime change in a another country. I am pretty sure Putin is happy to have Orban in charge of Hungary too, and not someone else.

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Quoting: Purple Library GuyRussia is there because they fear NATO encircling and strangling them. They fear NATO encircling and strangling them because that is something NATO seems to be doing and it has been often stated as a goal by US and NATO leaders.

Load a world map into your paint application of choice. Paint all NATO nations (including Finland and Sweden if you want) blue and Russia red. And then tell me what part of this looks like "encirclement"... *rolls eyes*

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Quoting: Purple Library Guy

Quoting: Kimyrielle

Quoting: CerberonEuropeans continue to hurt themselves in hopes of hurting Russia.

So did the UK and France when they declared war on Nazi Germany. Doesn't mean it was the wrong thing to do. For the exact same reasons. It's the nature of war that whatever you're doing, it's also hurting yourself. In the case of the sanctions, sure they will hurt the West, too. As long as it hurts Russia more (and it does), it's still a strategic win.

I agree with everything you say here except maybe the "and it does". From a brute strategic point of view, the US + entourage may have shot itself in the foot with this.

If you refer to the oil and coal embargo, I am inclined to agree with you. Prices for these commodities are sky-high right now, so even if we're buying less, Russia is still overall making more money, and there are still enough countries out there willing to buy from them. This has to be viewed as a long-term thing, rather than anything. Since we're apparently unwilling to ship enough heavy weapons to turn the tide of this war solidly in favor of Ukraine, this might go on for years to come, and eventually the sanctions -will- work.
What really hurt them and will continue doing so was the sanctions against their ruling elite. These people just love bragging with their wealth, but almost all go-to places for showing off wealth are now off-limits to them (Istanbul just isn't Zurich or Monaco) and some lost a few of their expensive toys on top of that. There seems to be considerable unrest among the elites that used to back Putin, and that's a good start.
As for the Ruble, yes, it's stable for now, among things because whoever's running Russia's central bank is doing a fairly great job at stabilizing it. But again, it's not sustainable. You can safely expect the Ruble to plummet, the question is just when. That's the general problem with sanctions - they absolutely work, but with a significant delay. Russia is a major country on a map, but its economy is actually quite small. Its GNP is about as large as Spain's, and (to quote Obama) they don't make anything except oil and weapons anyone would want to buy. They bought almost everything from us and they no longer can. China can not compensate all of that. I am pretty sure China is enjoying us and Russia bashing heads, but they're still happy to do business with us and they really don't want to lose the business anytime soon. In the end, Russia will feel the sanctions, and I'd guess they already do.

As for the future, yes, what you outlined is very likely going to happen. The world is going to split in two or more blocks once more. A US-led democratic and a China-led autocratic block, with Russia becoming China's main bootlicker as a bigger version of North Korea. And very little interaction and trade between these blocks. Been there, done that, got the "I have been born in the Cold War and seen it all" T-shirt. History repeats itself, again and again. It's a shame, but humanity will apparently never learn. I lost the last rest of faith in it a long while ago, so what can I say?

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Quoting: CerberonEuropeans continue to hurt themselves in hopes of hurting Russia.

So did the UK and France when they declared war on Nazi Germany. Doesn't mean it was the wrong thing to do. For the exact same reasons. It's the nature of war that whatever you're doing, it's also hurting yourself. In the case of the sanctions, sure they will hurt the West, too. As long as it hurts Russia more (and it does), it's still a strategic win.

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Quoting: etamI think that selling this DLC and giving a cut from income to some good charity would be also an acceptable solution.

Even if they did that and donated 100% of the proceedings to charity, I think pretty much nobody outsides of Russia wants to touch Russian-themed content with the proverbial 10-foot pole right now. It wouldn't really sell well anyway.

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It's the right call. Unfortunately, in this case, there was no unpolitical decision available. It's a shame that they blew so much money on making a product they in all likelihood will never be able to sell before it is horribly outdated. The time it will take for Russia to be an accepted member of the international community again will be measured in decades, not years...

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Quoting: senpaigamer123

Quote"I also want to make Twitter better than ever by enhancing the product with new features, making the algorithms open source to increase trust, defeating the spam bots, and authenticating all humans.

I guess it's time to delete my account...

Won't help you. He wants to authenticate all HUMANS, not all Twitter users. :P

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I don't do social media, but any single individual controlling any large media is always concerning.

Then again, that's true for most mainstream media not called BBC. "Free speech" usually translates to the opinion of whoever owns it.

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Offices are still a thing? :P

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