Quoting: ArtenThere is one more think. 30% is a misleading. Valve has their cut only if they sell it. But if developer generate key and sell it elsewhere (humble bundle,...) key is free, game has full support of steam store but valve has 0 money from it. So in 30% is also calculated usage of infrastructure for "black passenger" whom did not payed it. Devs did note use this? How it is Valve fault? Devs have this option!

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2019/04/why-valve-actually-gets-less-than-30-percent-of-steam-game-sales/

I think that's really interesting. Thank you for sharing. I did not know that. Great engagement tool. I assume the idea is to re-capture the consumer once they get back to Steam for the next and subsequent purchases?

I assume it's a great lock-in tool on the sales side too since a key seller doesn't need thier own infastructure, there's no point in investing in a full store/client/distribution system. Hence no full on competition to Steam since they need Steam for thier store?

Edit. Sorry for the double post. Im honestly not sure what I did.

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Quoting: scaineThat's why these devs, who got thousand plus sales before the algorithm change, suddenly...

Quoting: Purple Library GuyThat thing Scaine is talking about with the algorithm, that's terrible, and very real

While I agree with you, I think it's worth asking if the algo is really the main issue or is it control they have over a games potential success?

Valve basically can pick the winners and losers by what they decide to put on thier store front. Wether they use an algo or not to make those picks seems secondary. Would you agree that is more the core issue?

Valve sometimes uses an algo to put games on the store front. From what I can see they also handpick things as well (thier self promotion is pretty obvious to me). I'm curious how much active manipulation they do to the results beyond thier self promotion. I'm also curious how much extra a publisher or dev has to pay for that service. I'd expect it's the type of service that's only offered to certain clients.

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Steam is the Amazon of PC games.

Quoting: GuestThat's not the whole story of the lawsuit though. It's not just about a 30% cut, it's also about if you want to sell on Steam and another store, then Valve are (allegedly) forcing certain conditions related to using the other store. That puts a different perspective on the matter - it is (allegedly) using the market share of Steam to keep other stores from offering better prices.

I would imagine, this, if true, is the crux of the issue. I know of what I assume are other "non compete" clauses in other industries, but most I've heard of are smaller, face to face businesses (like doctor's and such).

Quoting: kuhpunktYou can't force being popular. No algorithm in the world can change that.

Fun fact, you can do that actually, to some extent. The best name I've seen for it it the "Brain Dead Megaphone" but I'm sure there's better one from the marketing world. It's not complicated in theory, but not easy in practice. Luckily, Valve is in a rather unique position to actually be able to do it with minimal effort. Most examples I've read about are political or marketing, so I think the premise fits:

Presume popularity = communication (how much is talked about, mentions, if you will)
The idea of that you saturate the "media" with that message. Eventually, because it's every where, other people start talking about the message. It's a natural effect of it being "in your face" all the time.

A more practical example would be Valves game Artifact. They put it on everyone's steam page. Even have it that announcement window. For days. Every time you open steam. Valve has the shear numbers to get a large number of people to engage with ita, start talking about it and then you see it on gaming websites (most likely coupled with a Press release). And we can see the result. Fairly high player counts which causes it to remain on the charts for some time (possibly further increasing counts). Now obviously, we know the counts fell off a cliff, but popular doesn't have to be forever. Most fads aren't. Remember Pogs?

Another example is from another store. I really believe you cannot find a single webpage on GOGs domain that doesn't have CP2077 on it. Similar saturation idea. By my understanding, also fairly good sales?

These are fairly easy examples, as both outfits have a lot of resources and eyeballs to achieve this effect pretty easily. Almost in a unique way as they reach millions rather effortlessly due to thier market position. It's much harder for a smaller outfit (think like a more traditional PR blitz) because the ability to grab eyeballs is more limited.


They key here is that it is forced, as opposed to other things, like the Among Us craze, which, as far as I understand, was mostly "word of mouth" via streamers and social media. Similar function, the reputation, seeing it everywhere. Just a different genesis; more organic.

--source: I was forced long ago to take a cooperate organization and messaging class... 10 weeks... I'm glad I finally got to use it... Thanks for letting me sound smart!

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Quoting: Luke_NukemI remember buying this on release because a linux port was promised.. that was what, 6 years ago? More?

This came out in 2004/5-ish? It was the first to go full 3D IIRC.

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From the description I think of Arcanum.
I might keep an eye on it. I really like the premise.

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Quoting: TheSHEEEPThat... does look improved, sure, but not like a 70GB game.

I'm a little curious about that too, especially with the reported high FPS reported in the article. I imagine the size might relate to the sheer number of assets?

I'm also curious about the gameplay. How is the balance? Are there still non historical/fantasy units like in the original? How is the enemy tactical AI?

This might be my one exception to purchasing a game this year, so I'm really curious as to some of the improvements and your alls thoughts on it.

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I think, for me, the compelling part of GOG is the DRM free nature. When they go out of business (and they will), I'll still have playable games. When Steam goes out of business (and they will), I have no garuntee that the games I paid to play, I will be able to play.

I've been burned by other stores closing in the past, so I'm a little wary in that regard.

I still use both services and find them acceptable. Steam is very easy to use which I like. GOG lets me have control, which I also like.

Besides to be fair, what other stores are there? Everything else I can think of is either a key-reseller or novelty.

Quoting: CatKillerand one could overclock one's computer with a pencil

Hehe, takes me back. Good old Athalons. Wow I don't even remember how to spell it, been so long. Thanks for that, and for sharing your perspective. And thank you Purple Library Guy for your thoughts as well.

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Quoting: poiuzThe whining about GOG is really bugging me. If you're happy with your DRM gods & Proton then good for you. Just stop the constant complaining about GOG. That's not "ignoring GOG".

Sorry dude, It's popular to hate on stores that aren't Steam here, with the exception of Itch.io, mostly because no one considers it a "real store".

Something, I do find interesting, although a bit tangential to this topic is what we as a community are willing to sacrifice for our comfort or easiness, myself included.

I saw a few posts above lamenting how it's not easy to play a Linux game from GOG and how antiquated the concept of downloading the game off the website is. Yet, we spend a lot of effort adding PPAs, learning the CLI (talk about something actually from before 1998), ldd, protontricks, winecfg, mesa, kernel stuff, tinkering, hacking, sometimes just to get mostly functional desktops.

I wonder how many of us really want to "play on Linux" (sorry for the pun)? The more I think of it, the more I wonder if I really do. Don't get me wrong, I love Linux and I like Tinkering with it in ways that I could never do with windows or Mac. I'll never go back! And haven't in over a decade.

But when I want to play a game, I find it really frustrating when I'm missing a library that I have to hunt down or a new kernel doesn't play nice with my graphics drivers or have to tweak wine/proton with my limited game time. It's like I'm frustrated because I'm reminded I'm on Linux with it's flaws and complexities. I just wanted the game to work without problems and relax!

Maybe for us the problem isn't GOG's Linux support. Maybe the problem is more that GOG reminds us we're still on Linux when we'd rather not be reminded of such.

Perhaps that's part of the allure of Steam. It's makes effort to make the Linux-ness of the system not apparent. With proton in the background, many things just work, like on Windows or Mac.


I find this an interesting contradiction and by looking at the comments, I think it's one many of us, myself included, are comfortable with having.

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Nice news about Monster Sanctuary. I think Monster Crown got a recent update as well.

I liked Endless Sky (although I was really bad it). Kinda the same for me with Transcendence. (Also really bad at it)

I'll have to try them again. So fun

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Yeah, this game literally looks right up my alley, except for the multiplayer part, lol. Had anyone had a good experience solo? The stream reviews seemed not so keen on it.

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