This boy is so cute https://cdn.cloudflare.steamstatic.com/steamcommunity/public/images/clans//4/080b1f163b02a9810fa78f0b32b9396fab012aef.gif

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Finally, child slavery !

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I've been using shotcut for a while because it's so easy to use, but it lack good object tracking or a way to plug opencv. What's the object tracking status in Kdenlive ?

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QuoteBut irrelevant when compared to the importance of not breaking user space.

Nothing got broken. A two decade of depcrecation function got removed, but nothing broken. Or do we just expect everything to be forever maintained ?

Quoting: TheSHEEEPAlso, so what if they did that 20 years ago?
Somehow, EAC and a bunch of others still ended up using that function. Probably looked something up online, copied the function, it worked and that's it. Or had auto-complete suggest something, or whatever.
You can't expect programmers to double-check every single function they use for possible deprecation, that's absurd.

I don't expect anyone to check, I expect a CI or a quality gate to stop them from shipping.

Quoting: TheSHEEEPDeprecation warnings in compilations get overlooked.
That's not good, you can call it bad practice or whatever makes you feel good about yourself, but in practice, it happens. A lot. And that's the reality that has to be dealt with, not some kind utopia in which programmers have eradicated bad practice...

I'll call it bad practice, or just not being up to 2022 standards.

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Quoting: Guest

Quoting: minidouI fail to see how glibc devs could be blamed for removing a function deprecated for 17 years (though I can agree a major version bump should have been called for). Do videogame devs need that much nursing ? EAC linux lib is a recent piece of software, how many deprecated dependencies do they use ?

The blame is not really about removing the deprecated feature. Blame is for the failure to restore it after discovering that users for the feature still exist and the removal broke stuff.

They did restore it because of the backlash, but they really shouldn't have, there's no reason for it. This isn't some obscure lib we're talking about but the GNU C library. If a handful of program gets broken it's on them, the function was marked deprecated almost two decades ago. An outstanding majority of program have no issue at all with the removal of this function, why should a niche but maybe high visibility user dictate the direction of glibc ?

Something not discussed here is that the removal of DT_HASH allows a save of about 1% or 16kB of space per Glibc shared object. This is an improvement. There clearly is a good reason for finally removing this deprecated function. But we shouldn't profit from this improvement because of some devs bad practice ?

Quoting: TheSHEEEP

Quoting: GuestThe blame is not really about removing the deprecated feature. Blame is for the failure to restore it after discovering that users for the feature still exist and the removal broke stuff.

Yes, a lot of developers (especially newer, younger ones that lack the experience) argue in favor of always using the very latest everything and always keeping everything updated.
I've seen that time and time again in several teams.

But that's not a position that can be maintained in reality.
You'd require armies just to maintain old stuff.

It's fine to remove a function if you can't see that anyone is using it. An understandable mistake.

This is off topic. The impacted softwares were initialised years after DT_HASH was marked deprecated. In the case of EAC lib, probably a good 15 years later. In every sector of the software industry this would be considered bad practice, but VG softwares get a pass for some reason.

Quoting: TheSHEEEPBut the moment you realize that there were indeed many still using it, it should clearly be restored (with a deprecation marker, but still).

They did that, almost two decades ago.

And it seems there isn't that many users impacted. I can count the EAC lib and some lib used in shovel night. Compared to the millions of programs using glibc.

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Also, didn't Valve add the steam runtimes to counter exactly this kind of issue ? If some software need ancient dependencies, don't use system ones, use a set of libs managed by steam.

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I fail to see how glibc devs could be blamed for removing a function deprecated for 17 years (though I can agree a major version bump should have been called for). Do videogame devs need that much nursing ? EAC linux lib is a recent piece of software, how many deprecated dependencies do they use ?

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still no DBD

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They've been saying that every six months for ten years.

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QuoteWreckfest (Verified)

Good, more people should play Wreckfest.

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