Quoting: Purple Library GuyBut the thing is, since Linux is a potential weapon specifically against Windows, it is a weapon effective in direct proportion to how well it stacks up against Windows as a (gaming) platform. Making Windows better as a gaming platform (like by making Proton work on it so Windows users can play old games), therefore, reduces the potency of the weapon. Which isn't to say they absolutely won't do it if they feel they have more to gain than to lose, but that loss is there.

I don't think they'd gain that much, either--most Windows users would just use Proton to play the back catalogue of games they already bought but can't play any more, rather than spending new money.

I see Valve as mostly a "good guy" when it comes to companies, so I would generally expect them to extend the tool to Windows just because they can and it's good for their users. Even if commercially the only benefit is goodwill. You do bring an excellent point with that last remark, though. Proton on Linux is quite likely to drive sales, whereas on Windows the impact will likely be much less noticeable. Although, I reckon even a much smaller percentage of increased sales on Windows would easily outshine Linux sales in absolute value no matter how much the latter grow. I guess it could go both ways depending on how hard Valve wants to push Linux.

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Quoting: baccilusWhy are so many people testing games on older drivers?

I, for one, started avoiding driver updates when they broke my entire system. Since I needed a specific version to achieve a playable state with one particular game, and that driver didn't break anything, I never updated again since setting that up.

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Quoting: PatolaIt generates false sales data. You get "money", pay your expenses, then you have to return the money. That can be a disaster, since that's what developers live by. It might well be in the customer's rights to do that, but it does not change the fact that impacts developers a lot. If the amount of people doing refunds is small, it's tolerable and can be compensated by other means. If it's large, in a barely profitable game which seems to be the majority of titles lately, it might lead to bankrupcy in the worst case.

Of course, you might not consider it "abuse" since each individual is acting in his/her own right. Maybe we can get a better word for it? "Overuse" does not communicate the idea that the developer is being harmed.

Well I don't know, considering the 2-week limit on no-questions-asked refunds, I'm tempted to say that 1) the devs might not even have received the money from that sale in that time (I don't know how they get their cut from Valve but presumably it's not transferred to their bank account on a per-sale basis), and 2) it's on them if they spend money that they know is still under the refund period.

I would expect Valve has ways to minimize this. Making too many payments would tank everyone's profits in transfer fees, and I wouldn't be surprised if sales amounts were frozen for 2 weeks so that Valve can handle the majority of refunds on its own without money going back and forth between accounts (Customer -> Valve -> Publisher -> Valve -> Customer would dilute so much of the amount in transfer fees that it would be outright dumb not to prevent it). By using an electronic wallet for both customers and third parties, they can essentially handle the majority of payment operations on their own without fees, excepting only the initial purchase and the actual money transfer to the devs, no matter what happens in between.

So I get your point, but Valve really needs to get a new accountant if that stuff hasn't already been straightened out.

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Funny - I was hoping the video in the article would show Liam's issues with the game from his personal playthrough, but even the trailer's audio is so muffled that I didn't pick anything up from it while reading the comments. QED.

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Quoting: scaineBecause of the nature of Proton, I can see a lot of potential abuse of the refund system, along with bad reviews, as Wendigo suggests. Buy a game, doesn't run in proton, leave a crap review, refund game.

Reviews aside, can you elaborate on what part of this you consider abuse of the refund system? I would definitely refund a game if I buy it intending to run it via Steam Play and find out it doesn't run well enough. The 2-hour allowance is very well suited for this kind of demo/test run approach.

Quoting: GuestIf they start allowing games with native Linux ports to be run under Proton anyway - how are the Linux porters supposed to know whether that was a "real" Linux sale, or a Windows sale thats being run on Linux via Proton... in other words, how do you stop this damaging legitimate Linux sales revenue that should go to the porters like Feral, Aspyr and VP ?

Wouldn't the problem be the opposite since Proton play counts as Linux? i.e. "Bad devs" who no longer support a broken port still get a cut from Steam sales even though people are effectively forced to emulate the Windows version instead of playing their port.

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Quoting: thykr

Quotethis could be a massive push for more people to actually play their games on Linux, get more people actually install Linux and so on

Quote“if x game worked on Linux, I would be on Linux”

I really doubt this.
Those few adventurous Windows "gamers" who might have been seduced by the idea of using GNU/Linux instead of Windows, will very quickly realize that their games run like crap in Wine / Proton. They will quickly move back to Windows with their tail between their legs and probably never think about using GNU ever again.

By that logic, why are you here? Why am I here? Why didn't we all go back to Windows?

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Quoting: Wendigothe Publishers have 3 choices:

1) Do nothing and get a bad rating that affects their future sales of the game.
2) Make sure their game runs with Proton on all operating systems that Steam supports and hope that a future change in Proton doesn't break the game.
3) Do a proper cross platform port or develop future games with cross platform in mind and have control over the game's performance on Linux and OSX.

4) Demand Valve remove their game from Steam Play, or from Steam altogether if that is not an option, so they don't have to deal with the unwanted support requests and bad press.

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Quoting: Dunc

Quoting: Expalphaloga symbol used by the Knights Templar.

It's never going to be an Assassin's Creed game, but let the speculation begin... :D

Black Wind, Fire and Steel is a song by Manowar. Black Wind blows on black flags. And that star has 8 points, like a sailor's compass. Assassin's Creed IV: Black Flag confirmed.

;)

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Quoting: DuncBut I don't really follow games that aren't already on Linux very closely, so I'm struggling to think of recent ones with “forge” in the title.

I'm in the same boat. First title that comes to mind is Demon's Forge but that's PS3-era.

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Quoting: adolsonIf I'm a developer, I don't see why I should put any effort into a Linux version. Especially now that Valve has a solution in place that removes any effort on my part.

Look at how many games don't run or aren't really playable with Proton and there's your answer.

Quoting: GustyGhostEven though WE, here at GoL and the larger Linux community in general, plan to stick to our guns buying native ports, this does not mean that the same holds true for everyone who will now feel comfortable adopting Linux. The gamers who migrate because of Proton are ultimately concerned only with GAMES and will buy only with the mentality that they MUST have said game with no regard to whether the title is native or not.

1) All of us who came to Linux from Windows had a tipping point. We weren't born convinced that open source was the way and that we could live without xyz software that only exists on Windows. We dipped our toes in, found things we liked and things that chafed, considered it for a while. Eventually we found a setup or situation that was right for migration. Most of the first people who will adopt Linux following Proton's implementation won't be people who've never heard of open source before. They will be people who tried a distro or two and were interested but driven away by the lack of games. Having so many more compatible games all of a sudden will be that tipping point for them where they say "Okay, I can live without my handful of games that still don't run on Linux, because at this point they don't outweigh the benefits for me." Or the point where they start actively dual booting and only using Windows when necessary. We're not looking at overnight changes, we're looking at making progress towards a very complex goal and easing the transition for more and more people, which in turn gives more clout to all of us.

2) While we're all on this site for gaming, I'm looking at the bigger picture and seeing improvements to Wine and drivers as a great boon for all kinds of software. Let's not forget that gamers aren't the only ones who shun Linux because of a lack of compatibility with their favorite/mandatory software. If Wine and/or Proton progress to the point where professionals can use their .exe productivity software on Linux without a hitch, that's another important segment we can unlock. And again, once developers see that there is an attractive userbase that's adamant about running their software on Linux, they'll want to make sure it runs to its best and doesn't get overshadowed by any competitors that are trying to tap that market.

3) On both fronts, once people start using open source actively, they will be exposed to the philosophies and ecosystems around it little by little. Many may not care, but more advanced users will see the benefits of the libre way of computing. In time, this creates more people submitting bug reports, promoting libre culture and making donations to support volunteers. I, too, was once a Windows user that didn't care and used freeware and pirated software everywhere I could. Practicality came first, and mentality changed over time. Now I volunteer for OSS projects from time to time and donate to a few every year as well as supporting some orgs monthly. It's not everyone, but there are other people like this out there waiting for the right time to transition, and our strength is in numbers. Exposure is the first step, and everything that brings more people over to Linux gets the ball rolling at an individual level.

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