Quoting: wojtek88

Quoting: Cyba.Cowboy

Quoting: GuestNo Feral port, no money. At some point, we need to support those who support us, dude. I love the Tomb Raider reboot games but won't play Shadow without a native port, unless 3 or more years pass and Feral decides not to port it.

This.

They've already ported the first two games, so it's pretty likely they'll port the third game at some point... I don't like the fact that they're (the reboot "Tomb Raider" games) not on GOG.com, but I'll absolutely buy the other two games because Feral look after us, so the least I can do is look after them, by purchasing a full-price copy of the second and third games (with only rare exceptions, I refuse to purchase Linux games at a discount)(unfortunately, I was still-booting when I bought the first game though!).

In theory I agree with you guys. Feral is a company, that we owe most of the AAA titles. We need to support them as much as possible.
But...
Without clear agenda of releases it's not ok to expect from us that we're not going to buy new games, that just works, because they may have port in next 2 or 3 years.
We need to adapt to new reality, so as Feral.
I also don't like "No Tux, no Bucks" approach for Proton titles at the moment. Valve invested money in Proton / Wine / DXVK. Now very often I read that people are going to use Steam Play only for titles that they already have in their libraries. Personally I think this is the worst approach that you can imagine. Of course while testing Proton that's fine, but when it's released, only buying new titles that are meant to be run on Proton will generate real money return for Valve's investment.
Sure, we can buy 3 years old titles to achieve that, but very often 10 titles that are 3-5 years old will cost less than just released game.

So maybe it's good idea to buy few titles that are not so old and run well with Proton instead of writing everywhere "No Tux, no Bucks".

Valve doesn't care which or how many games you buy, they only care how much you spend. They get the same cut either way if you spend $60 on one Windows game or 6 ten-dollar Linux games. The purpose of Proton isn't to drive sales per se, it's to make Linux a more credible threat to Microsoft. If Proton emboldens someone to uninstall Windows, or to just use it less, or to try Linux for the first time, those are all big returns on Valve's investment, even if they never buy another Windows game.

I'm not necessarily saying you should never buy newer Windows games to play on Proton -- it's up to everyone to choose how strict they wanna be about supporting Linux devs -- I'm just saying you don't need to overthink "repaying" Valve for Proton.

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Quoting: Guest

Quoting: Smoke39

Quoting: GuestActually....wine was already in pretty good shape without funding from Valve. Gallium-nine never had backing and was in excellent shape, though has fallen by the wayside it seems.
But this is really my point: people are praising for Valve for....good business choices?
I've never said their contributions are useless though - far from it. And their contributions help outside of themselves at the end of the day. I just find it odd how people are so willing to give credit to Valve for things that others have done instead. Give credit to both, I say.

This article is specifically about Valve integrating wine into steam, and about their funding of DXVK. People are praising them for these specific things. The notion that anyone's giving them credit for anything else seems to be something you're cynically reading into things yourself.

That notion is from people's comments, not the article.

I understand that you're referring to people's comments. I'm arguing that you're inferring things that people aren't actually saying.

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Quoting: Guest

Quoting: Shmerl

Quoting: GuestIf it makes people feel better I can point out really great things Valve have done (mostly around Vulkan tooling and drivers). But I have to ask: if wine didn't exist, if dxvk didn't exist, would Valve have tried to create either?

You can ask the same thing about Linux and choosing it for their projects like SteamOS. Would they create their own OS to avoid Windows? That's the benefit of FOSS. You can use existing work and contribute back.

Quoting: GuestAnyway, Valve does this for Valve. Not for GNU/Linux. I hope people realise this. And yeah, Valve can be congratulated for investing things that help out, but the way I see it, the victory is not from Valve. It's from wine developers. From doitsujin and all who contributed to dxvk (which, yes, has some partial help from Valve). It's from open source tools that make this possible, it's from open source drivers that make this possible, it's from Khronos for the amazing work they've been doing on Vulkan. It's from Lutris showing that this is indeed possible. That's where my praise is.
That's why I don't feel the need to rave on about Valve - I'm too busy praising all the foundational and open source work that hey're building on. Valve have simply picked the best solution, and I do congratulate them on bankrolling things and helping improve that solution. It's just....hmm....to me, and I stress "to me", ranting about Valve ignores all the hard work that is being built upon, and I've never liked that.
So I just like to comment to make people aware of how awesome wine can be, how awesome open development is, and how great it is that GNU/Linux makes all this even possible.

Sure, it's all by those developers. But Valve funded them and without that funding, progress would have been a lot slower, no doubt about it. So Valve deserve credit for contributing to FOSS projects instead of their own walled garden / silo.

Do they have selfish motives? Likely, they aren't doing it just for charity. But result is still positive. A lot of progress in Linux itself is driven by major for profit companies who use that very progress for their own benefit. That doesn't make their contributions useless.

Actually....wine was already in pretty good shape without funding from Valve. Gallium-nine never had backing and was in excellent shape, though has fallen by the wayside it seems.
But this is really my point: people are praising for Valve for....good business choices?
I've never said their contributions are useless though - far from it. And their contributions help outside of themselves at the end of the day. I just find it odd how people are so willing to give credit to Valve for things that others have done instead. Give credit to both, I say.

This article is specifically about Valve integrating wine into steam, and about their funding of DXVK. People are praising them for these specific things. The notion that anyone's giving them credit for anything else seems to be something you're cynically reading into things yourself.

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Quoting: GuestBtw quote from fckdrm.com

QuoteSupport digital preservation

By choosing the right sources, you know that the content you bought will remain with you – no matter when it was created or for what hardware.

Can someone can tell me why then GOG is on list?

As hard as i loking at my Neverwinter Night Diamond they still only have Win download, after linux version
got out some time age for silly excuse its still dont back

The point is that you can still play your local copy (as well as copy it to new devices) even if the game goes "out of print" or is otherwise no longer supported.

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Quoting: KeyrockPlease don't let this become another Mighty No 9.

MN9 had one delay that backers weren't informed about until DAYS after retailers had been informed. With another, later delay they decided to release a demo version as an apology. The distribution of said demo was then, itself, delayed. Comcept also started a Kickstarter for their next game before MN9 was out, despite frustrations with delays and concerns over its quality. And it wasn't even for a full game, just a prelude? And it was actually already funded by an outside investor, which wasn't mentioned in the initial pitch, so what exactly was the Kickstarter for again? Oh, and they also had a separate Kickstarter for an anime tie-in with said game, because of course they did. Ask Acclaim how trying to force your IP into a multimedia franchise before it's firmly established worked out. Oh wait, you can't; they went out of business.

Lol, sorry, that got a little more ranty than I intended. :b My point is that Comcept had some pretty clear signs of mismanagement. Maybe I've missed something, but I haven't gotten the same impression from Bloodstained. When Iga says they want some more time to address player feedback, I'm more willing to believe him.

Lack of Linux support (and lack of even an official word on it) for the spinoff is pretty frustrating, though.

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Vulkan incoming: https://twitter.com/SVKaiser/status/1025115114788347904

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Quoting: liamdaweI'm just deciding not to take it as personally as some are. Nothing more, nothing less.

I've always been realistic about Linux gaming and some people choose to be the opposite.

Totally understand things can get emotional, but I won't have people call out my integrity for not sending abuse to a developer.

I'm all for giving leeway to devs who make a good faith effort, but I'm not for letting anyone walk all over us just for showing nominal support. Linux needs software to grow, but it won't do any good if it doesn't actually work. We can disagree on where to draw the line, or where on the spectrum this specific case lies, but I don't think I'm "unrealistic," and I don't think it's reasonable to characterize everyone who disagrees with you as such.

I also think it's unreasonable to conflate any and all criticism of the devs with "sending abuse."

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Quoting: MayeulCWeren't all hats in the same, tabbed window already? I found this "feature annoying".

Yes. You could also already disable that feature, if you found it annoying.

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Quoting: LeonardKAlso many people criticized Valve for their Greenlight project because it had not enough curation. This is another restriction gone, which will mean many low-quality games might try get on there and make it difficult to find anything.

Content standards and quality standards are two completely different things. Banning anime tits isn't gonna do anything to stop asset flips.

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Quoting: MayeulCNice, I liked Turok: Evolution on Xbox back in the day. But I am a bit lost with the timeline... Or the series. I would like to play Evolution again, but did it see a PC release as well?

It is always strange to realize that the games I played when I was younger actually had a "story".

Evolution comes first chronologically, followed by 1, 2, and 3. 1 and Evolution both star Tal'Set as Turok. 2 stars Joshua Fireseed, several generations later. 3 is a direct followup, and centers on Joshua's siblings, Joseph and Danielle.

There was a PC version of Evolution, but I think it was only released in Europe. The remasters are built on a whole new engine, though, so I'm not sure existing PC versions are really a requirement for consideration. I'm hoping we get the whole series eventually. :)

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