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  • Chipset/CPU/LAN/mainbaord driver quality Intel vs AMD
Chipset/CPU/LAN/mainbaord driver quality Intel vs AMD
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HerrLange Jan 4, 2018
Hi,

I plan to obtain a new desktop computer this year (upgrading to >= 64GB DDR4 & 8cores/16Threads).

My last two systems were Intel based. One reasons here was the trust in Intel getting very good drivers for theire Chipsets, LAN chips etc. From the various servers I get in touch during my worklife I knew the same for the CPUs. Therefore I buyed orignal Intel mainbaords with as much as possible intel only chips. However Intel has stopped offering mainboards for consumers.

One pro for AMD Ryzen 2 would be ECC and no IGP.

So here my questions/discussion points:
- What are your experiences with AMD Ryzen/Epyc Motherboards? Any issues?
- How about coreboot or similar?
- Why do you stay with Intel (or not)?
- Is there any mainboard vendor for desktop/workstations showing more engagement for Linux than others?

Best regards,
Mad
g000h Jan 4, 2018
I've been using AMD Ryzen chips and MSI B350 MATE motherboards as PC upgrades across the whole office. (Work for a big games company.) No problems for me with these systems, although primarily Windows 10. Also, I've been specifying Nvidia GTX 1060 6GB as the standard graphics card.

Also, of interest is the latest breaking news on the Intel chip design flaw, which can be fixed two ways - (a) A new Intel chip released without the flaw, or (b) Operating System Kernel fixing to stop the flaw being exploitable.

The OS fixes are likely to slow down Intel chips by 20% of their current performance. "Just Sayin'"
tuubi Jan 4, 2018
Quoting: g000hThe OS fixes are likely to slow down Intel chips by 20% of their current performance. "Just Sayin'"
It's funny how everyone has their own percentages for this, and very few are based on actual benchmarks. Phoronix actually tested some games with PTI enabled, and there doesn't seem to be any impact at all. Unless you game in a VM, maybe? It's definitely a problem for some memory-heavy real-world workloads though.
g000h Jan 4, 2018
Quoting: tuubi
Quoting: g000hThe OS fixes are likely to slow down Intel chips by 20% of their current performance. "Just Sayin'"
It's funny how everyone has their own percentages for this, and very few are based on actual benchmarks. Phoronix actually tested some games with PTI enabled, and there doesn't seem to be any impact at all. Unless you game in a VM, maybe? It's definitely a problem for some memory-heavy real-world workloads though.

Every single game is going to be affected differently (as well as affecting different Intel processors differently). You can't put an exact percentage until you have a specific system, benchmark the specific game, apply the patch, and benchmark the game again.

People have been mentioning slow-downs of between 7% and 30% typically across the internet. My take on that is you could easily expect 20% slow-down as a ball-park figure.
HerrLange Jan 4, 2018
Quoting: g000hI've been using AMD Ryzen chips and MSI B350 MATE motherboards as PC upgrades across the whole office. (Work for a big games company.) No problems for me with these systems, although primarily Windows 10. Also, I've been specifying Nvidia GTX 1060 6GB as the standard graphics card.

Is any of the PCs runnning Linux? If so which distro?

Quoting: g000hAlso, of interest is the latest breaking news on the Intel chip design flaw, which can be fixed two ways - (a) A new Intel chip released without the flaw, or (b) Operating System Kernel fixing to stop the flaw being exploitable.

The OS fixes are likely to slow down Intel chips by 20% of their current performance. "Just Sayin'"
I don't think AMD is not affected as written in the other thread. However as I plan to wait for Ryzen 2 or the next gen Intel CPU I'm awaiting a hardware fix for this bug. Therefore this will not affect my solution (as long as all parties deliver a hardware bugfix).
dvd Jan 4, 2018
Quoting: madchaotikanHi,

I plan to obtain a new desktop computer this year (upgrading to >= 64GB DDR4 & 8cores/16Threads).

My last two systems were Intel based. One reasons here was the trust in Intel getting very good drivers for theire Chipsets, LAN chips etc. From the various servers I get in touch during my worklife I knew the same for the CPUs. Therefore I buyed orignal Intel mainbaords with as much as possible intel only chips. However Intel has stopped offering mainboards for consumers.

One pro for AMD Ryzen 2 would be ECC and no IGP.

So here my questions/discussion points:
- What are your experiences with AMD Ryzen/Epyc Motherboards? Any issues?
- How about coreboot or similar?
- Why do you stay with Intel (or not)?
- Is there any mainboard vendor for desktop/workstations showing more engagement for Linux than others?

Best regards,
Mad

Coreboot is next to impossible on (modern) x86. If you want entirely free system, and have lots of money, support raptor engineering by buying one of their talos 2 workstations here.
tuubi Jan 4, 2018
Quoting: g000h
Quoting: tuubi
Quoting: g000hThe OS fixes are likely to slow down Intel chips by 20% of their current performance. "Just Sayin'"
It's funny how everyone has their own percentages for this, and very few are based on actual benchmarks. Phoronix actually tested some games with PTI enabled, and there doesn't seem to be any impact at all. Unless you game in a VM, maybe? It's definitely a problem for some memory-heavy real-world workloads though.

Every single game is going to be affected differently (as well as affecting different Intel processors differently). You can't put an exact percentage until you have a specific system, benchmark the specific game, apply the patch, and benchmark the game again.
Yes. I know what benchmarking means. So does Michael at Phoronix, usually. (I usually avoid his site for completely unrelated reasons.)

Quoting: g000hPeople have been mentioning slow-downs of between 7% and 30% typically across the internet. My take on that is you could easily expect 20% slow-down as a ball-park figure.
My point was that your ball-park figure is completely meaningless, especially if it's based on ball-park figures other people have come up with around the internet. I'm not trying to downplay the fact that this is a real problem, but throwing around numbers based on guesswork isn't helpful.
HerrLange Jan 5, 2018
Trying to save my thread by bringing back the Question regarding your experiences regarding Linux drivers for the current Ryzen/Epyc platform. Anything bad or good to say?

Also the question regarding mobo vendors. Is there one more 'Linux afine than the others? I tend to buy supermicro. Which vendor do you prefer?
Guppy Jan 5, 2018
I'm curious what do you mean motherboard drivers support? - In 21 years I have never had Linux not work due to the motherboard nor have I ever loaded any special drivers to it.

In the past 6 or so years the only time I can even recall having driver issues was;

  • Ubtuntu 16.04 providing stock drivers on the boot cd that would turn off the screen on computers with Nvidia GTX 970

  • My Crucial M4 SSD needing a firmware update that had to be done from a dos boot disc



The first is just Canonical being asses and refusing to update their ISO with drivers that work, the second was a hardware thing.

Every thing else I've plugging into/installed in my desktop has just worked, so are you just being cautious or have you genuinely had driver issues with Linux in recent years?


ps. not attempting troll here - just genuinely curious
Avehicle7887 Jan 5, 2018
My experience with Ryzen has been very positive since I built mine. I've had almost zero issues with it so far.

My Specs:

Ryzen 7 1700X
Asus Prime B350M-A Motherboard
2x 8GB G.Skill Memory - Running at 2800MHZ
MSI GTX 1060 6GB
Western Digital 2TB HDD

Back when I built this, Ryzen had been released for about 3 weeks and I installed Mint 18.1 (Comes with Kernel 4.4). Aside from the CPU temperature readings, it recognized everything I've thrown at it and the system has been stable all along. Currently still running Mint 18.1 / updated with kernel 4.14.8.

It's not Linux specific, but my experience with Asus motherboards is a good one, they also released many Bios updates (12 in total) for my board.
tuubi Jan 5, 2018
Quoting: Avehicle7887It's not Linux specific, but my experience with Asus motherboards is a good one, they also released many Bios updates (12 in total) for my board.
I've been happy with Asus for a couple of decades as well. Even when things go wrong (and sometimes they do regardless of manufacturer), their RMA process has been painless in my experience.
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