Android every month is getting an even bigger threat to Linux x86-64. Linux x86-64 is part of the PC market that is getting weaker. We can see that individuals have many devices with Android: smartphones, tablets, and laptops. I can't say that most people have few computers with x86-64.

In this case, companies more frequently prefer to abandon games for Windows/Linux/Mac. In this case, they focus on selling games for Android and porting them to iOS. It's a more profitable market for many of them.

More interestingly, more games for Android than for Linux x86-64 make Proton useless in these situations.

Linux isn't a replacement for Windows.

Transgaming did an incredible job with Cider for Mac. I can't say it about Cedega/WineX for Linux, which was a failure.

Wine/Proton creates unrealistic expectations among Linux users. It's easy for some companies to increase this need for a better version of Wine. Unfortunately, it's impossible to fulfill these dreams and expectations.

Proton/Wine will never be better than Windows because it's a technology developed and controlled by Microsoft. Of course, it could be possible to fulfill these expectations when Microsoft starts developing its version of Wine. I think it's unlikely to happen soon.

I can't say it's a perfect system. Sometimes, I think that Linux is as horrible system like Windows. On the other hand, I have many games for Linux that I didn't buy for Windows or download only versions for Linux. Now, I can't even download some of them or buy them for Windows.

Does it mean that Linux is a better choice for me than Windows?

Sometimes, I don't have a choice, and it was a matter of preference among systems.

I don't see the answer to this question in this discussion.

Do you see a value and sense in using Linux as the tool to run some native games for Linux?

Windows is a unique platform for running games for Windows. We will get the "better version" with a unique name in the next few years.

Last edited by gbudny on 25 June 2023 at 2:42 pm UTC

Quoting: gbudnyThat is a terrible example.

No, it's apt because there are a lot of those eON monstrosities.

Bioshock Infinite, too.

Every stinking one of those runs like utter shit these days, if they work at all.

The point is, I'd rather have a game working well through Proton.

Last edited by Grogan on 25 June 2023 at 4:31 pm UTC

Quoting: gbudnyThe lack of technical support is just a minor inconvenience. You can use the old version of the operating system or try to troubleshoot it.

Tech support schmeck support... I've never had much luck with that. Has anybody ever tried "tech support" for a software product? You'll be better off asking other users in forums and such. Maybe somebody knows a solution, instead of those canned idiots whose real job seems to be getting you to go away.

Maintenance is important, but nobody guarantees that it works, not even $3000 productivity software. If it runs afoul of changing APIs later, they'll have a paid upgrade that fixes you up.

The difference is that they are just coming right out and telling you to your face that they can't support every configuration. With games now it's not a big risk (easy to refund).

Quoting: gbudnyLook at ArcaOS, Haiku, AmigaOS/ MorphOS, and the current availability of commercial games for these operating systems. The previous generation of users had their chance and threw it away. They can only dream about games from Steam, GOG, HIB, etc.

I'm quite surprised at how many games get ported over for MorphOS / AmigaOS4. Though generally they are the exact same ones that get native Linux support, and generally done through opensource engines.

I'll start this by saying I do use Proton where applicable.

But I'll add a caveat to how annoying it is.

Let's look at games like Skyrim. They work wonderfully in Proton. But there is no mod management, and that game definitely is enhanced by mods.

Let's poke at the Forgotten Realms: The Archives (vol 1-3). On Steam it does not list Linux support. GOG has the Linux installers. But most people these days would love to use the Goldbox Companion, which is a windows binary. Just reading this post shows how annoying the situation can be; https://forum-ubuntuusers-de.translate.goog/topic/goldbox-rpgs-gold-box-companion/?_x_tr_sl=de&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en

I can think of many other cases where using Proton, due to third party utilities to make the game better / more modern just gets in the way. Native in these cases would be much better. (I haven't tried it yet, but can you even get real MIDI working through DosBOX running through Wine?)

Quoting: Grogan

Quoting: gbudnyThe lack of technical support is just a minor inconvenience. You can use the old version of the operating system or try to troubleshoot it.

Tech support schmeck support... I've never had much luck with that. Has anybody ever tried "tech support" for a software product? You'll be better off asking other users in forums and such. Maybe somebody knows a solution, instead of those canned idiots whose real job seems to be getting you to go away.

Maintenance is important, but nobody guarantees that it works, not even $3000 productivity software. If it runs afoul of changing APIs later, they'll have a paid upgrade that fixes you up.

The difference is that they are just coming right out and telling you to your face that they can't support every configuration. With games now it's not a big risk (easy to refund).

I asked Ubisoft tech support about something years ago. Was actually shocked they fixed my issue.

Games that used eON are a fine example, as are Feral ports. The reality is: every game uses some form of abstraction or translation to get their cross-platform support. What level will people go to before they accept it? Proton runs games you've purchased, on your machine, at a level often very comparable to Windows regardless of how the developer cares for Linux. It should be accepted not frowned upon, but I feel that element of the community will likely never go away.

Quoting: Perkeleen_VittupääTo many concerned, Wine/Proton actually IS native. Well yes; we're not talking about an emulator, it's an open source reimplementation of what makes Windows programs run.

If a certain game developer aims for Proton rather than for Windows, that's fine by also many Linux standards, and it can be said that boy do they stretch nowadays. It's one of Linux' feats: it can be flexible! Windows? Not so much...

Here's another thing: you'll hear Tux giggle all the way from its igloo on top of the world if Windows makes an update that breaks that game, while it still works on Wine.

What i personally think/want? ALL those games just to work on Linux "clicking play"! No matter through what. That's what a common user cares about too. For things to work. That's it. Things break on Windows side all the time too, btw. Computing is still far from humane, perfect or whatnot in general...

When Linux usage keeps rising and reaches certain levels, THEN the native ports prolly come back in a new major way.

It's not native in the same way as me using Google Translate to read German is me reading German natively. :) It's a translation layer to turn Win32/Win64 API calls into Linux/Elf calls. Well unless you're running it on an non-x86 CPU, then it IS an emulator :P

Quoting: Liam DaweWhat level will people go to before they accept it?

When game companies say "play our games on Linux, using Proton. We support that and will ensure our updates don't break things."

I'm not going to shell out £60 of my own money on a product that a) isn't supported by the developer, and b) may not work tomorrow (if it even works today).

Right and I buy plenty with big discounts. I buy games as a gamer interested in the game specifically, not just or only because it “supports” Linux with a special native build that most devs say over and over hasn’t really been worth it.